Flashes.

[Cyberman]

Stimbo

Your eyes should do the finding out for you; we don't "hear" about the sun shining or the moon rising. God is that honest, we see it by our own eyes.

A deepity with a non-sequitur attached? This is what passes for apologetics these days?

At least you acknowledge the importance of actual evidence over faith. Now present a god.

[WinterHold]

I never said anything about expectations. Projecting much? I think two decades was enough for my patience. I'm not going to waste the rest of my life on woo that made me more suicidal than I've ever been. It will end up being a very short life.

Your life is precious; Jesster. As a matter in fact, we live for ourselves after all; work so our lives be integrated with all the components that makes up the word "good".

God doesn't need us. We need him. 

I know that you didn't mention expectations; but I had them once ; so I guessed it was the same in your case.
Just a guess.

[Jesster]

God doesn't need us. We need him. 

Except I don't. If there is a god, it never did anything for me when I was a believer. Now that I'm not weighed down by religion, my life seems to have some value.

[pocaracas]

I'm kinda honored to have had a more thorough reply!

pocaracas

Thank you, but I'd rather not pretend. I want to know. Really know.

But you actually know; what you doubt is enough for me.
The signs are just too many. Too too many, they never end with watching the skies, they don't also end with watching what's on earth.

'Argument from design', acknowledging the design is a fine first step though.

But.... it doesn't look designed. It looks like the whole Universe just formed itself. And the more complex forms we now observe were all built up by the previous generation of simpler forms through self-assembly.

You perceive the signs as too many because, like most people, you are ignorant of what is explained or explainable and what is not explained or explainable. I am too, but perhaps a little less on certain key areas which let me see those signs as mere trifles.

Thus far, given the accumulated human knowledge, nobody knows anything about any god... all pseudo-knowledge about the gods comes from faith...

I would call it a strong message. Thousands of years, and the echo of theism still rings.
Something is out there.

Yes, something: Human ignorance, human dreams, human desires, human fantasies... human greed, human power, human subjugation...

Hardly a trustworthy source of information...

But humans are known to say that to any source that says what they don't like; take the bully kids in school who used to torture Teacher "pants-on-board" for not having being bald. But they truly just hated him for teaching Biology.

Yes, humans do that, too.
But this is not the same. Here, I'm talking about being intellectually honest with one self.
I cannot accept information about an alleged timeless entity that seems totally absent today.... information stemming from a particular location on this planet... information which seems manufactured (no matter how well intentioned such manufacture was)

If there is such an entity, capable of communicating unambiguously with humans, and who wishes humans to follow its rules or desires, then that entity should come forth and let us all know about it.
That it doesn't... and that humans keep taking over that job... is a clear hint to me that the entity has been manufactured - man made - human invented.

Faith is not a virtue, it's a mechanism of self-delusion.

A self-delusion that must be justified, somehow... so, how better than to make it a virtue?

Aren't video games are?
Movies?
The shelves stacked with novels?
Love stories of the princesses and the vampire prince, making out in the mist?
Mermaids ?
The American Dream?
The Chinese National Anthem?
The British "long live the Queen"?

Humans love delusion. They even call it "fantasy".
There's even a known verb: "fantasizing".

Faith can't be distinguished from other fantasies; but a believer would say "I woke up and there was just too much that keeps pushing me back into the fantasy. Looks like it's not a fantasy; this is a reality !"

Well... thank you for confirming what I just said: self-delusion.

[Cecelia]

http://thedropnews.com/wp-content/upload...x900-1.jpg

Flashes.

In Barry We Trust.

[Harry Nevis]

I never said anything about expectations. Projecting much? I think two decades was enough for my patience. I'm not going to waste the rest of my life on woo that made me more suicidal than I've ever been. It will end up being a very short life.

Your life is precious; Jesster. As a matter in fact, we live for ourselves after all; work so our lives be integrated with all the components that makes up the word "good".

God doesn't need us. We need him. 

I know that you didn't mention expectations; but I had them once ; so I guessed it was the same in your case.
Just a guess.

We need god?  Are you guessing that is the case for everybody again?  You know what they say about assuming....