Why aren't the Indians more grateful?

[abaris]

My question is relating to you saying "our" wrong doings.  Are you talking all of humanity should accept that we've done things that were wrong?  In terms of our ansestors.

In respect to our particular society, yes. Everyone has their own wrongs in the past. And an individual reason to do better.

[paulpablo]

My question is relating to you saying "our" wrong doings.  Are you talking all of humanity should accept that we've done things that were wrong?  In terms of our ansestors.

In respect to our particular society, yes. Everyone has their own wrongs in the past. And an individual reason to do better.

I don't necesserily agree that we technically are from the same society, you're German as far as I know and I'm from the UK.  But why wouldn't that apply to all societies?  And just in respect to what you call our society?

[abaris]

I don't necesserily agree that we technically are from the same society, you're German as far as I know and I'm from the UK.  But why wouldn't that apply to all societies?  And just in respect to what you call our society?

I'm not German, but that aside. I'm going by western societies, which have a lot of dirt at their hands. Different dirt, to be clear, but dirt anyway. It's got nothing to do with guilt but everything with being aware of that history. In order to not repeat what has been done in the past. And in order to extend a hand and make good on what has been done, if possible.

[brewer]

I have white guilt for the hippies. Poor, poor hippies. I shouldn't have indulged with you. Bad Mark!

[Mr Greene]

Personally I find that anyone who attempts to describe European colonialism as either good or bad invariably knows **** all about it.

I would be hard pressed to find anything good on European colonialism. Other than serving their home country that is.

They set up a chain of monocultural economies that didn't serve the place when they finally got independence. What's more, they weren't interested in ethnic integrity of the region, which led to many civil wars over who's ruling whom after colonial rule was over. It also prevented all these regions from finding their own identity and an equal role in the global economy.

There have been worse and better colonial regimes. The Belgian king's rule over the Kongo probably one of the worst, but that doesn't mean that any colonial rule ever cared over the wellbeing of the indigenous people there.

At the start, they were sold of into slavery and at the end they were exploited to serve the need of the motherland in question.

So, no. You can't say, colonial rule provided much of a benefit to the people in the colonies. Only for the motherland, in terms of trade goods and global influence.

Apart from the development of global trade to take part in, the dissemination of ideas and culture across the planet in all directions, the development of hybrid cultures and scientific knowledge, etc. etc. etc. 
Or is Singapore still an uninhabited mangrove swamp? Do Indian and Chinese goods not pass your threshold? Do we not have morphine, telephones, the theory of Evolution? 
The thing about globalization is that everyone on the globe benefits from it.
Except perhaps Nationalists who find the benefits inconvenient for their preferred narrative.

[abaris]

Apart from the development of global trade to take part in, the dissemination of ideas and culture across the planet in all directions, the development of hybrid cultures and scientific knowledge, etc. etc. etc. 
Or is Singapore still an uninhabited mangrove swamp? Do Indian and Chinese goods not pass your threshold? Do we not have morphine, telephones, the theory of Evolution? 
The thing about globalization is that everyone on the globe benefits from it.

But you are aware that Indian or Chinese goods have been traded as far back as the Roman Empire, probably earlier? You are aware that the Egyptians traded with large parrts of Africa before we even left the caves? Under their own steam without needing us for exporting their goods while at the same time exploiting their work force.

[Mr Greene]

The development of the Global trading network is an ongoing process; From the Phoenicians, to the Carthaginians, to the Romans, to the Venetians, to the Portuguese, to the Dutch, to the British, to the Americans and now to the Chinese. 
Who is this "we" you speak of living in caves? You are aware that the Egyptians trading across Africa are almost certainly the ancestors of everyone on this forum?

[paulpablo]

I don't necesserily agree that we technically are from the same society, you're German as far as I know and I'm from the UK.  But why wouldn't that apply to all societies?  And just in respect to what you call our society?

I'm not German, but that aside. I'm going by western societies, which have a lot of dirt at their hands. Different dirt, to be clear, but dirt anyway. It's got nothing to do with guilt but everything with being aware of that history. In order to not repeat what has been done in the past. And in order to extend a hand and make good on what has been done, if possible.

Well I personally come from an English background, mixed with Irish.  And possibly some Spanish so I've heard. That's on my Dad's side.  My mothers side comes from a Polish and Russian background.  Or at least my Grandmother came from what possibly turned out to be taken over by Russia.

I don't see myself even in terms of my ansestors as being a part of anything I can identify as definitely being bad so I personally feel no obligation to personally make good on what has been done to anyone.  I barely even know what society my ansestors came from, what their roles in that society were or anything like that.

If you know exactly what your ansestors did that was wrong then I can actually understand people feeling that they owe a wronged group of people something. 

But I don't feel like I owe anyone anything to make good on what has been done just based on my skin colour or the position of the rock I was born on.

[abaris]

Yeah, I knew it was futile to even attempt to make you understand.

[Mr Greene]

Because you don't recognize yourself on both sides, Yin and Yang? 
Because you think you know the causes and effects of colonization and globalization better than an Anglo-Indian?
Nothing is ever as clear cut as that presented by those with an agenda.