What are the Characteristics of a NT Christian?

[Catholic_Lady]

I'd say believing that Jesus is who He says He is, and striving to live by the teachings of Christ as depicted in the bible. 

I think that's as basic and fundamental as you can get. If someone says they are a Christian but then they say they don't believe that Jesus was the Son of God, I'd say that person's beliefs are not in line with Christian beliefs. If someone says they are Christian but they live a life of greed and hatred, I'd say that person is not living the Christian lifestyle.

This is basically how I always saw Christianity too. Even though this applied to me at one time, some Christians today still give me the "you weren't a TRUE Christian" response anyway. It's like nobody can make up their minds about this.

I agree its silly to just throw that accusation around.

[vorlon13]

Here's how the Westboro Baptists are like the rest of the Christian schisms:

They themselves pick and choose which Bible strictures and edicts to enforce and which to ignore.  That they cherry pick different scriptures than some other denominations doesn't  confer on those other denominations the right to criticize Westboro for cherry picking scriptures, only for cherry picking the wrong scriptures in their opinion.

And of course, Westboro is just like all those other Christian denominations since they are ignoring so very, very many scriptures, despite a scriptural injunction against that very practice.

And if you think about it, "cherry picking the wrong scriptures" doesn't invalidate those scriptures, it instead indicts those also cherry picking, it absolutely doesn't invalidate those unchosen scriptures!  So declining to rebuke the denominations not selecting the same scriptures as the Westboro folks doesn't absolve them of homophobia, it instead condemns them for heresy/apostasy.

So, all the Christin denominations are 'like' Westboro in that regard, or they "'aren't doing it right" and a similar indictment of Westboro is of course valid since they "aren't doing it right" either.

[Brian37]

This is basically how I always saw Christianity too. Even though this applied to me at one time, some Christians today still give me the "you weren't a TRUE Christian" response anyway. It's like nobody can make up their minds about this.

I agree its silly to just throw that accusation around.

There are Trump voting Atheists and Obama voting atheists, so yea, I don't go around accusing other atheists of not being a "true atheist" merely because I don't agree with everything another atheist might claim. The only core position we have  is "off" on god claims.

Now, if you can accept that from me regarding other atheists, then try to understand why your holy book does not point to a perfect being and perfect manual. Both you and Drich have the same core position that the god of the bible is real. 

See the problem? Same problem Sunnis and Shiites have with the Koran. Same reason you cant get a Tibet Buddhist to agree with a Chinese Buddhist who wont agree with a Japanese Shinto Buddhist.

Again, our species morality isn't coming from our labels or mythology. Not even the world "atheist" should be viewed as a moral code. Our species behaviors both good and bad, are in our evolution. There is not one nation, friend or foe alike, that does not have hospitals or prisons.

[RoadRunner79]

I guess the problem is that a lot of the members here seem to know pretty much only the types of Christian people who are extremely ignorant, deny science, and hate gays (or perhaps those are simply the only ones who stick out in their mind?). I'm not going to deny anyone here that this has been their personal experience with Christian folks, but personally for me, I truly don't see that. For example, only once in my life did I ever talked to a person who said they don't believe in evolution. I have literally only heard that once from one person, lol. I mean, sure, you see and hear about crazy people on TV or whatever, but that's why they are on TV... because they are crazy and not your average person.  

My experience has been that most of us are just completely normal people, who aren't complete morons and who don't hate others for their sexual preference. Especially having been living the military lifestyle for the past 4 years, and being surrounded by a TON of Christians who are totally friendly, intelligent, educated,and normal. So it's hard for me to understand all this talk on the forums about Christians being this and being that. Perhaps a lot of you guys are from the deep south? I've lived in Brazil, Ohio, Florida, and Texas, so I don't know what the culture is like in that part of the country. Maybe therein lies the difference... I dunno.

I also find a number of atheist, who seem to not be able to contemplate a Christianity that is different than what is in their mind. This may be from experience, or perhaps there are other motivations to why they argue what they do. It is quite annoying however being expected to defend something that you don't believe, and where not saying. It seems like often I spend more time trying to get people to let go of there assumptions.

With that being said, there are a number of different views in Christianity. I was on a Christian Forum before, and there where some pretty wacky ideas, that where not normally very well supported. Some of the particularly interesting ones that I found dealt with going back to the Greek, and arguing that the orthodox view was a translation issue. The problem often being, is that the the Greek Orthodox, didn't hold this view, historically, or contemporarily and it only came about late, mostly from people who had minor education in Koine Greek language. These differences can originate by coming from a different worldview, sometimes from ignorance or because they just haven't though about it much, and somethings are debatable. I find these same things occur in atheism too. The difference being, that individualism is often championed concerning atheists, yet belittled when in regards to believers. It's not a consistent principal, and really doesn't have any logical consequence concerning Christianity. When I am in contact, with someone who disagree's, I ask why. I normally, I strive to be able to answer that question when asked of me as well.

By the way, I am one who could say, that I don't believe in evolution, I could also say I'm skeptical; and that I believe in evolution. All depends on what you are talking about when you say evolution. So perhaps you have not met two people. However my thoughts on evolution are not relevant to my theology.

[Catholic_Lady]

To Vor:

But the things is, they aren't ignoring some random stuff from the OT that could or could not have been written allegorically. They are ignoring the fundamental teachings of Christ Himself. Which as Christians, we cannot turn our back from. Jesus specifically said "one of the greatest commandments is to love your neighbor as yourself." He even told us to love our enemies!

Yet the Westboros go around and say God hates gay people, and that we should hate gay people, and that it's good when people are tragically killed, even children. Those are directly contradictory to the fundamental Christian beliefs, due to the fact that Jesus Himself so often spoke of loving everyone and turning the other cheek.

---

I guess the problem is that a lot of the members here seem to know pretty much only the types of Christian people who are extremely ignorant, deny science, and hate gays (or perhaps those are simply the only ones who stick out in their mind?). I'm not going to deny anyone here that this has been their personal experience with Christian folks, but personally for me, I truly don't see that. For example, only once in my life did I ever talked to a person who said they don't believe in evolution. I have literally only heard that once from one person, lol. I mean, sure, you see and hear about crazy people on TV or whatever, but that's why they are on TV... because they are crazy and not your average person.  

My experience has been that most of us are just completely normal people, who aren't complete morons and who don't hate others for their sexual preference. Especially having been living the military lifestyle for the past 4 years, and being surrounded by a TON of Christians who are totally friendly, intelligent, educated,and normal. So it's hard for me to understand all this talk on the forums about Christians being this and being that. Perhaps a lot of you guys are from the deep south? I've lived in Brazil, Ohio, Florida, and Texas, so I don't know what the culture is like in that part of the country. Maybe therein lies the difference... I dunno.

I also find a number of atheist, who seem to not be able to contemplate a Christianity that is different than what is in their mind.  This may be from experience, or perhaps there are other motivations to why they argue what they do.  It is quite annoying however being expected to defend something that you don't believe, and where not saying.   It seems like often I spend more time trying to get people to let go of there assumptions.  

(my bold)

Oh my gosh, this is so true!

[vorlon13]

While I personally may be relieved many Christian denominations these days are nowhere near as homophobic as Westboro Baptist, please understand I will nevertheless criticize those same "liberal" denominations since they are committing heresy, and also that by failing to acknowledge their heresy, they are not doing "The Lord's" work as He sees fit, they are doing it as THEY see fit.

And that ain't religion, that's a big step towards atheism.


Yea team !!! Go ATHEISTS !!!

[RoadRunner79]

Off topic - and at the moment, your argument from incredulity doesn't concern me, in regards to this discussion.
This also has nothing to do with what I said, or against anything I was putting forth.

The only one gullible here is you. I agree it doesn't concern you that you fell for a bad claim. It should, but no, not surprised in the least that you stupidly think you are more than a mere apologist. 

FACTS matter, and the book you claim to be true is not backed up by facts.

Taking my words out of context (bolded above), doesn't improve my thoughts on your comprehension skills, nor your ability to make a coherent argument.  I'm done responding to your false assumptions, and personal attacks.   I'm not really interested in talking about you anymore, nor what you imagine about me.

[Catholic_Lady]

By the way, I am one who could say, that I don't believe in evolution,   I could also say I'm skeptical; and that I believe in evolution.   All depends on what you are talking about when you say evolution.  So perhaps you have not met two people.   However my thoughts on evolution are not relevant to my theology.

Oh I was referring to in person. I have seen other theists on here say they don't believe in it, but only one person in real life has ever told me they don't believe in it.

[Neo-Scholastic]

That would be the NT. Your inability or unwillingness to refer to it has no bearing.

BULLSHIT, your mythological Jesus writers in the NT clearly contradict each other as to OT law applying. You don't get to blame us for something we didn't write.

Your character as the NT writers claimed DID say he came to uphold old OT laws. Stop being intellectually dishonest.

To bad for you that you have absolutely no facts on your side to support your belligerent assertions. And yet you continue to beclown yourself.

[Jesster]

To be fair with the Westboro Baptists, they are following scripture very clearly. They might be cherry picking a few parts of scripture that they like more, but they aren't doing that any more than the more friendly Christians. Even though I know which Christians I prefer to deal with, I'd still consider members of each group to be Christians. This goes back to my first post in this thread.

I'd remind you that many of us were Christians at some point. Our objections to Christianity are valid enough whether you identify with them or not. If I did want to argue against your specific beliefs, though, I would ask you what you believed instead. Individual Christians always interpret their religious beliefs in different ways.