Am I nuts? I like Jesus..:)

[Mister Agenda]

Here's my latest batch of replies in pretty green ink..-

Drfuzzy quote- "It's a book of fairy tales. Atheists see no evidence for the existence of any deity"
Some atheists are not so sure..

You got us! Most atheists aren't any more sure that God isn't real than we're sure pixies aren't real. Meanwhile, Dawkins continues to maintain exactly the position he has always said he did regarding the existence of God: It's remotely possible that God might actually exist, to the same degree that it's remotely possible that any other deity might exist.

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JC simply meant that his generation wouldn't pass away before seeing the establishment of Christianity on earth. Mission accomplished..[/size]

"Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom." Matthew 16:28

Do you know what an 'ad hoc explanation' is? Like when an ESP experiment fails to verify the existence of ESP and the researcher reasons that some people generate 'ESP static' that interferes with the experiments. Also known as a 'just so' story.

Someone in the audience would reasonably have taken Jesus to be talking about his permanent return in glory to rule the world. Since that didn't happen, an ad hoc explanation had to be made up in order to be able to say that this statement is still true, at the cost of changing its plain meaning.

[Minimalist]

Except, of course, there was no audience and there was no jesus.  This is all shit that was made up later.

[vorlon13]

Where Scripture records Jesus being wrong about something and His followers are thrashing about with improbable, ludicrous, silly and contrived apologetics to try and straighten out another mess Jesus has gotten them in to, well, gosh darn it, Jesus COMES ALIVE FOR ME !!!!!

[Brian37]

To me Jesus ROCKS, for example here he is in action against the snooty priests telling them they're full of shit, so can I ask whose side atheists are on, his or the priests?

"You're like whitewashed tombs which look clean on the outside but on the inside are full of the bones of the dead and everything unclean" (Matt 23:27)

I used to be obsessed with 80s rock singer Pat Benatar, but guess what? I grew up and out of it.

[The Valkyrie]

Wow, this sensational thread has already produced 5 pages of replies, proving yet again just how much interest a young 30-yr-old carpenter generates 2000 years after his worldly death and makes Christianity the biggest peloton on the road..
Jesus said - "I've beaten the world" (John 16:33)

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Here's a selection of AF members quotes from pages 1/2 with more to come, my replies are in pretty green ink-

Chad32 quote- "What's this about dissing his mother that one time?.."
Where? In what verse did JC diss his mum?
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Mister Agenda quote- "..Personally, I just pick out the good stuff (like the parable of the Good Samaritan) and ignore the rest."
And which was the bad stuff ?
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Astonished quote- "..This is the problem with hero-worship. You idealize the person and ignore their flaws.."
What flaws did JC have?
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Mordant quote- "We have different reasons for not believing (for example) that Jesus was god...
.....he doesn't denounce slavery or affirm women as something more than chattel...
....At the end of the day Jesus is a product of his times, leading from behind...
1-Good for you mate, only cack-brained fundies think JC was God, despite him saying he wasn't.-
Jesus said -"Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone" (Luke 18:19)
2- Jesus didn't have a bucket list of things to denounce, for examp he never said a word about GLBT's, not a single word..
3- I wouldn't think being crucified is "leading from behind"
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Vorlon13 quote-"..atheists reject 100% of all Gods."
Yay for atheists rejecting phoney "gods", but the Judeo-Christian god is the real deal, so don't throw him out with the bathwater..
 God said- "Like a scarecrow in a melon patch, their idols cannot speak; they must be carried because they cannot walk. Do not fear them; they can do no harm nor can they do any good." (Jeremiah 10:5)


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Deidre quote- "So you've never stood up for something you believe in OP? That's all Jesus was doing, in that story."
JC made it clear he wasn't operating on his own initiative as a one-man show-
Jesus said - "For I have not spoken on my own authority; but the Father who sent me gave me a command, what I should say and what I should speak" (John 12:49)
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Khemikal quote- "..Jesus rates as an also-ran in the overall field of good ghost stories.."
Thomas thought JC was a ghost too til he said- "Here you numpty, feel my scars!"-

Seriously? Look how popular Jesus is by the comments?

That would be like thousands turning out to see the execution of a notorious serial killer and the killer screaming "look how many people live me!"

[mordant]

Mordant quote- "We have different reasons for not believing (for example) that Jesus was god...
.....he doesn't denounce slavery or affirm women as something more than chattel...
....At the end of the day Jesus is a product of his times, leading from behind...
1-Good for you mate, only cack-brained fundies think JC was God, despite him saying he wasn't.-
Jesus said -"Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone" (Luke 18:19)
2- Jesus didn't have a bucket list of things to denounce, for examp he never said a word about GLBT's, not a single word..Smile
3- I wouldn't think being crucified is "leading from behind"

1-The divinity of Christ is a primary credal litmus test for Christian orthodoxy. It is one of the central defining characteristics of the belief system. I was addressing that. Of course it's made up, but I'm addressing the actual prevailing beliefs, which can hardly be chalked up to a minority of "cack-brained fundies".

2-That was exactly my point. If you're going to speak out against immorality, intolerance, etc., you should have a bucket list and certain things should be on it. Otherwise you're not offering humankind of 2K years ago, anything enlightening. Much less humanity today.

3-My point was about moral (non)leadership. Are you suggesting that we should all get crucified too? I don't think the crucifixion (assuming Jesus was a real person and he was in fact actually crucified) is any sort of example or moral statement, that's a whole separate topic. If all you can do to explain away Jesus' deafening silence on certain topics that he supposedly had unique authority and creds to speak to, by deflecting to some other allegedly noble thing he did, then it doesn't speak well for the strength of your argument.

[Brian37]

Mordant quote- "We have different reasons for not believing (for example) that Jesus was god...
.....he doesn't denounce slavery or affirm women as something more than chattel...
....At the end of the day Jesus is a product of his times, leading from behind...
1-Good for you mate, only cack-brained fundies think JC was God, despite him saying he wasn't.-
Jesus said -"Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone" (Luke 18:19)
2- Jesus didn't have a bucket list of things to denounce, for examp he never said a word about GLBT's, not a single word..Smile
3- I wouldn't think being crucified is "leading from behind"

1-The divinity of Christ is a primary credal litmus test for Christian orthodoxy. It is one of the central defining characteristics of the belief system. I was addressing that. Of course it's made up, but I'm addressing the actual prevailing beliefs, which can hardly be chalked up to a minority of "cack-brained fundies".

2-That was exactly my point. If you're going to speak out against immorality, intolerance, etc., you should have a bucket list and certain things should be on it. Otherwise you're not offering humankind of 2K years ago, anything enlightening. Much less humanity today.

3-My point was about moral (non)leadership. Are you suggesting that we should all get crucified too? I don't think the crucifixion (assuming Jesus was a real person and he was in fact actually crucified) is any sort of example or moral statement, that's a whole separate topic. If all you can do to explain away Jesus' deafening silence on certain topics that he supposedly had unique authority and creds to speak to, by deflecting to some other allegedly noble thing he did, then it doesn't speak well for the strength of your argument.

If you admit that it is made up then doesn't matter if you think some are "Crack brained fundies". I agree it is made up so why should anyone follow an old book of mythology?

[drfuzzy]

Drfuzzy quote- "It's a book of fairy tales. Atheists see no evidence for the existence of any deity"
Some atheists are not so sure..

[Image: http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/Po...357b9a.jpg]

What does Dawkins have to do with anything?  As has been stated ad-nauseum (pay attention now) there is no atheist creed.  There is no atheist leader.  There is no atheist consensus.  Dawkins wrote some books, he's a popular speaker, he gets attention - there are thousands of Dawkins memes out there, some created by religious folks making "fake news".  (Handy term, that.)  The very definition of atheism as defined by Merriam-Webster is:  

a :  a lack of belief or a strong disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods
b :  a philosophical or religious position characterized by disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods

I will happily change my mind when your imaginary friend shows up, walks across a swimming pool, heals a few amputees and others, and answers a whole boatload of questions.  There is nothing you can say or do or post that will fulfill those requirements.  

[mordant]

If you admit that it is made up then doesn't matter if you think some are "Crack brained fundies". I agree it is made up so why should anyone follow an old book of mythology?

He was suggesting that the divinity of Christ is a fringe idea of a few nutjobs. It is a central tenet of Christian orthodoxy, and included in all the major credal statements. So it's the fringe idea of a whole LOT of nutjobs. You would be treated as a heretic by the vast majority of the church, Catholic and Protestant, for denying the divinity of Christ.

His implication is that I shouldn't have addressed that because no one important in Christendom believes it anyway. This is manifestly untrue. Those who complain the loudest ...

[ignoramus]

OP, you like Princess Leia more than Darth Vader?
That's cool...

You know, it's OK to like Darth Vader... in lots of different ways...
We know what the bible says about that!

Maybe you do like Darth a lot more but aren't allowed to admit it?
See, because of you're beliefs, we can never know?
You have no choice! Not your fault man.... It's cool...

When you're ready to come back from Narnia, Vorlon will be your spiritual coach in your new found freedom in this scary new world full of bigots and assholes. He's got your back...