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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 1, 2017 at 9:00 pm
It's not as though if Thump hadn't bolded those bits, then no one would be able to read them, lol. They're still things that he said. Focusing only on the police brutality bit while ignoring the broader context surrounding it is exactly how one might go about pushing a specific narrative. Wouldn't you say?
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”
Wiser words were never spoken.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 1, 2017 at 10:31 pm
Not really here to debate. . .
In an interesting twist, when Kap knelt originally I remember a lot of discussion about how there is not implicit racism, and black people are not being targeted. It was probably the second most common argument after the whole "Is this respectful" argument I would see.
Now when I see people angry with the protesting I don't see that at all. Most of the arguments I have seen that bother to address racial disparities start with "I know we have them but..."
I'm not sure if that is progress or because now that the protest has taken on a seemingly* more superficial role - protesting the POTUS - people with more moderate beliefs have begun engaging in the debate as well, thinking they have the right mix of middle ground to be relevant in the discussion. Or you know. . .it's just anecdotal and due to sample size.
*My understanding is that the protest is still about racial injustice??? Feel free to correct!
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 1, 2017 at 10:53 pm
(October 1, 2017 at 10:31 pm)Aristocatt Wrote: Not really here to debate. . .
In an interesting twist, when Kap knelt originally I remember a lot of discussion about how there is not implicit racism, and black people are not being targeted. It was probably the second most common argument after the whole "Is this respectful" argument I would see.
Now when I see people angry with the protesting I don't see that at all. Most of the arguments I have seen that bother to address racial disparities start with "I know we have them but..."
I'm not sure if that is progress or because now that the protest has taken on a seemingly* more superficial role - protesting the POTUS - people with more moderate beliefs have begun engaging in the debate as well, thinking they have the right mix of middle ground to be relevant in the discussion. Or you know. . .it's just anecdotal and due to sample size.
*My understanding is that the protest is still about racial injustice??? Feel free to correct!
Yes the protest IS about racial injustice, and those on the right are pissed off that statues glorifying ownership of other human beings are more important.
Meanwhile Puerto Ricans can just sing our National Anthem for shelter and food and clothing.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 2, 2017 at 1:37 am
(October 1, 2017 at 6:48 pm)alpha male Wrote: (September 30, 2017 at 5:26 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: It's true that he emphasized police violence, but in the parts I've emboldened,
IOW, he emphasized something, but you're emphasizing something different because you're pushing a different narrative. When he wears socks showing cops as pigs and says they're getting away with murder, it's clear what his main issue is.
Again, ignoring the root causes that he alluded to. He spoke about oppression, and you'd dearly love to skip those words because they speak to the wider experience of minorities in America. Sometimes those experiences include being killed by police officers because, you know, non-white. I doubt he would argue one bit with this narrative -- do you think he would?
If you don't see oppression and stand up against it, that's on you. Sweet dreams.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 2, 2017 at 7:43 am
(October 2, 2017 at 1:37 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Again, ignoring the root causes that he alluded to. He spoke about oppression, and you'd dearly love to skip those words because they speak to the wider experience of minorities in America.
You need to check the dictionary.
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/oppress?s=t
1. to burden with cruel or unjust impositions or restraints; subject to a burdensome or harsh exercise of authority or power
Less economic opportunity doesn't fit this definition.You're trying to change the narrative from the original.
Quote:If you don't see oppression and stand up against it, that's on you. Sweet dreams.
See the above definition. Unless you're still pushing police brutality, which I've addressed at length, then no, I don't see oppression.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 2, 2017 at 9:25 am
(October 2, 2017 at 7:43 am)alpha male Wrote: (October 2, 2017 at 1:37 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Again, ignoring the root causes that he alluded to. He spoke about oppression, and you'd dearly love to skip those words because they speak to the wider experience of minorities in America.
You need to check the dictionary.
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/oppress?s=t
1. to burden with cruel or unjust impositions or restraints; subject to a burdensome or harsh exercise of authority or power
Less economic opportunity doesn't fit this definition.You're trying to change the narrative from the original.
lol, you don't think that definition is what minorities in America have to deal with?
Really?
Look, I'll be happy to give you some information about this. How much time you got?
(October 2, 2017 at 7:43 am)alpha male Wrote: Quote:If you don't see oppression and stand up against it, that's on you. Sweet dreams.
See the above definition. Unless you're still pushing police brutality, which I've addressed at length, then no, I don't see oppression.
"Living is easy with eyes closed / misunderstanding all you see" ...
I think I'll drop this conversation with you for now. This admission of yours is more damning than anything I could write about you.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 2, 2017 at 9:30 am
So...Alpha didn't read the article then, lol.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”
Wiser words were never spoken.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 3, 2017 at 5:58 am
(October 2, 2017 at 9:25 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: lol, you don't think that definition is what minorities in America have to deal with?
No
Quote:Really?
Really. The Civil Rights Act was passed more than 50 years ago.
Quote:Look, I'll be happy to give you some information about this.
So why didn't you?
Quote:I think I'll drop this conversation with you for now. This admission of yours is more damning than anything I could write about you.
OK. As noted, de jure discrimination, which was oppression, was outlawed over 50 years ago. There still is some de facto discrimination, but in my experience that's been diminishing with each generation. I have minority colleagues and clients who are very successful. The NFL players making this protest are very successful. We just had a black president for 8 years for crying out loud. So, no, I don't see oppression.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 3, 2017 at 8:52 am
(This post was last modified: October 3, 2017 at 8:55 am by Thumpalumpacus.)
(October 3, 2017 at 5:58 am)alpha male Wrote: So, no, I don't see oppression.
(October 2, 2017 at 9:25 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: I think I'll drop this conversation with you for now. This admission of yours is more damning than anything I could write about you.
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RE: What is the controversy surrounding #takeaknee
October 3, 2017 at 10:37 am
(October 3, 2017 at 5:58 am)alpha male Wrote: Really. The Civil Rights Act was passed more than 50 years ago.
Why do you feel that is anything other than symbolic? Black people are a unique group with laws passed to specifically disenfranchise that group. The Civil Rights Act does nothing for black people specifically, the term 'minority' is used to to get around having to address issues specific to blacks.
Were minorities affected by Jim crow, or was it blacks? Did you know white women are classified as a minority? Did you know that white women benefit more from affirmative action than any other group?
If you stick a knife in my back nine inches and pull it out six inches, there's no progress. If you pull it all the way out that's not progress. Progress is healing the wound that the blow made. And they haven't even pulled the knife out much less heal the wound. They won't even admit the knife is there. - Malcolm X
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