Selfless Giving

[Bahana]

I'm wondering what you all think about the idealized notion that people should just give and not expect anything in return. An argument can be made that true selfless giving doesn't exist because it makes people feel better about themselves to do something for others and that becomes the reward. In the past, if I said to someone that I'll do this for you if you agree to do this for me, some people did not like it. I think Win-Win deals are better than Win-Lose deals. It's better than covertly expecting something in return.

[chimp3]

Is "selfless" real? If you get any satisfaction from giving then it is self reinforcing.

[The Grand Nudger]

I'm wondering what you all think about the idealized notion that people should just give and not expect anything in return. An argument can be made that true selfless giving doesn't exist because it makes people feel better about themselves to do something for others and that becomes the reward. In the past, if I said to someone that I'll do this for you if you agree to do this for me, some people did not like it. I think Win-Win deals are better than Win-Lose deals. It's better than covertly expecting something in return.

I'm a big fan of the notion...but I can second the claim that giving makes me feel good.  I don't worry about expectations of return.  I leave all of that for business.  If I tell someone I'll do or give this, in exchange for that...I'm working out a transaction.   

In the end, I don't think it matters whether or not giving is selfless.  If I dump a box truck worth of mixed veg to a food bank from time to time, and feel good about it, nothing about the act or consequence of that charity is modified.  If I get a tax break for it (and I often do), then it's a bonus...and the food bank still gets the food.  

If I -wouldn't- dump the excess production -unless- I got the tax break..well, that's not giving in any sense but a legal one, more a transaction.  A sale at reduced price through a third party.

[shadow]

I'm wondering what you all think about the idealized notion that people should just give and not expect anything in return. An argument can be made that true selfless giving doesn't exist because it makes people feel better about themselves to do something for others and that becomes the reward. In the past, if I said to someone that I'll do this for you if you agree to do this for me, some people did not like it. I think Win-Win deals are better than Win-Lose deals. It's better than covertly expecting something in return.

I think people are different - some people literally don't expect anything in return for doing a good deed. I'm personally usually going to expect an exchange of some sort, otherwise I won't be inclined to participate. But I respect and admire people who don't feel the need to derive benefit from doing good. That being said, I worry they get trampled upon and end up with fewer resources then the more capitalistic among us, which is why I would be inclined not to be truly selfless. I see true selflessness as something that weakens one's position and ability to have an impact in the future, even if it a well intentioned effort.

[Silver]

I don't give.

I prefer to selfishly receive.

[drfuzzy]

That term has always bothered me too.  You can give without expecting a gift in return.  But for most, the act of helping makes one feel proud of being able to make things better.  That in itself is the reward.  This is a good thing - but why can't we call it humanitarianism, and get rid of that "selfless" ridiculousness?

[brewer]

I give to dust mites selflessly all the time without any kind of thought.

[bennyboy]

First, tell me what the "self" is. Then we can decide if any action is selfless.

[chimp3]

I give to dust mites selflessly all the time without any kind of thought.

Is shedding really giving? I guess so, if we say we are giving off an odor.

[Astonished]

I'm wondering what you all think about the idealized notion that people should just give and not expect anything in return. An argument can be made that true selfless giving doesn't exist because it makes people feel better about themselves to do something for others and that becomes the reward. In the past, if I said to someone that I'll do this for you if you agree to do this for me, some people did not like it. I think Win-Win deals are better than Win-Lose deals. It's better than covertly expecting something in return.

I think if you expect that at the very least, the person you give to will take your kindness and generosity to heart and will, when the means or opportunity are available to them, pay it forward. So in that sense you can feel a sense of pride that not only are you being charitable you're also able to be proud that you're instilling (or attempting to instill) a moral lesson on someone else who may not have automatically shared that view until you proved the utility of such a concept. So while you personally may not be expecting to be the beneficiary of such a returned favor, someone else will and will vicariously owe you gratitude through the actions of one or more persons you helped and set a good example for.