Definition of "delusion" in DSM-5

[Alexmahone]

[chimp3]

I borrowed a copy of the DSM-5 from my university library today. In the glossary of technical terms, "delusion" is defined as

A false belief based on incorrect inference about external reality that is firmly held despite what almost everyone else believes and despite what constitutes incontrovertible and obvious proof or evidence to the contrary.

It then adds:

The belief is not ordinarily accepted by other members of the person's culture or subculture (i.e., it is not an article of religious faith).

Why do religious beliefs get a free pass? So if you're convinced Elvis Presley is still alive, you're delusional but if you think Jesus of Nazareth is still alive and can hear/answer your prayers, you're just a Christian. Why the double standard?

It has to do with the crippling effect of the delusion. If you believe Elvis is alive and you pay your bills go to work, school,etc. then you are just irrational and misguided. If you will not leave the house because you think Elvis is showing up to marry you (true story with a family member of mine) then your thoughts are delusional. When I worked as a psych nurse we tried to teach patients how to distinguish between their "normal" religious thoughts and those that are signalling another psychotic break. Religion was never discouraged and I know why. My entire family is religious, I have cared for those in a a psychotic delusional state, and these states are different.

[Kitan Etos]

I still personally comprehend "religious faith as delusion disguising reality".

[chimp3]

I still personally comprehend "religious faith as delusion disguising reality".

I use " delusion" loosely at times, but not in the clinical sense.

[Alexmahone]

It has to do with the crippling effect of the delusion. If you believe Elvis is alive and you pay your bills go to work, school,etc. then you are just irrational and misguided. If you will not leave the house because you think Elvis is showing up to marry you (true story with a family member of mine) then your thoughts are delusional. When I worked as a psych nurse we tried to teach patients how to distinguish between their "normal" religious thoughts and those that are signalling another psychotic break. Religion was never discouraged and I know why. My entire family is religious, I have cared for those in a a psychotic delusional state, and these states are different.

Surely you're changing the definition here. The DSM-5 doesn't say anything about the crippling effect of the delusion.

[chimp3]

It has to do with the crippling effect of the delusion. If you believe Elvis is alive and you pay your bills go to work, school,etc. then you are just irrational and misguided. If you will not leave the house because you think Elvis is showing up to marry you (true story with a family member of mine) then your thoughts are delusional. When I worked as a psych nurse we tried to teach patients how to distinguish between their "normal" religious thoughts and those that are signalling another psychotic break. Religion was never discouraged and I know why. My entire family is religious, I have cared for those in a a psychotic delusional state, and these states are different.

Surely you're changing the definition here. The DSM-5 doesn't say anything about the crippling effect of the delusion.

I am not changing the definition. Perhaps you are assuming that the DSM-5 is not a book detailing psychiatric disorders. Perhaps you want to trivialize the suffering of those people with schizo-affective disorder of the bipolar type, paranoid schizophrenia, dementia, brutal infectious processes which bring on delirium. Perhaps you want to equate these peoples diseases with a character flaw or a lack of intelligence.

[Alexmahone]

Surely you're changing the definition here. The DSM-5 doesn't say anything about the crippling effect of the delusion.

I am not changing the definition. Perhaps you are assuming that the DSM-5 is not a book detailing psychiatric disorders. Perhaps you want to trivialize the suffering of those people with schizo-affective disorder of the bipolar type, paranoid schizophrenia, dementia, brutal infectious processes which bring on delirium. Perhaps you want to equate these peoples diseases with a character flaw or a lack of intelligence.

I suffer from bipolar I disorder, OCD and psychosis. In the past, I've also suffered from hoarding disorder, BDD and PTSD. I've been in mental hospitals almost 10 times now. The first of those hospitalizations was involuntary, which is what caused the PTSD and simultaneously destroyed my relationship with my family. I take 900 mg lithium and 2 mg risperidone every night. This is why I was reading the DSM in the first place.

I am a 4th year math major who is planning to go to grad school. But due to my mental disorders I am only able to study part-time and I'll be 31 when I start my M.Sc. And you think I equate mental illness with a character flaw or a lack of intelligence. I have no words...

[chimp3]

I am not changing the definition. Perhaps you are assuming that the DSM-5 is not a book detailing psychiatric disorders. Perhaps you want to trivialize the suffering of those people with schizo-affective disorder of the bipolar type, paranoid schizophrenia, dementia, brutal infectious processes which bring on delirium. Perhaps you want to equate these peoples diseases with a character flaw or a lack of intelligence.

I suffer from bipolar I disorder, OCD and psychosis. In the past, I've also suffered from hoarding disorder, BDD and PTSD. I've been in mental hospitals almost 10 times now. The first of those hospitalizations was involuntary, which is what caused the PTSD and simultaneously destroyed my relationship with my family. I take 900 mg lithium and 2 mg risperidone every night. This is why I was reading the DSM in the first place.

I am a 4th year math major who is planning to go to grad school. But due to my mental disorders I am only able to study part-time and I'll be 31 when I start my M.Sc. And you think I equate mental illness with a character flaw or a lack of intelligence. I have no words...

I suspect then that you should know the difference between a person taking the Eucharist and then going about their day and one having a psychotic break and needing a hospitalization and mood stabilzers and antipsychotics to go about their day.
Addendum: I am sorry for your personal struggle. I have no pity for anyone speaking in tongues on Sunday. One situation is voluntary, one is not!

[SteelCurtain]

I borrowed a copy of the DSM-5 from my university library today. In the glossary of technical terms, "delusion" is defined as

A false belief based on incorrect inference about external reality that is firmly held despite what almost everyone else believes and despite what constitutes incontrovertible and obvious proof or evidence to the contrary.

So far, so good. It then adds:

The belief is not ordinarily accepted by other members of the person's culture or subculture (i.e., it is not an article of religious faith).

Why do religious beliefs get a free pass? So if you're convinced Elvis Presley is still alive, you're delusional but if you think Jesus of Nazareth is still alive and can hear/answer your prayers, you're just a Christian. Why the double standard?

I feel like the answer lies squarely in the definition. (bold mine)

[Rev. Rye]