Prove honesty is virtuous!

[Mystic]

Prove honesty is virtuous!

Step one: turn honesty into a mathematical proposition without addition or subtraction.

[SaStrike]

Step two: therefore god is a grounding cause

[Mystic]

Step two: therefore god is a grounding cause

[paulpablo]

Evolution is a wild beast.

How can honesty be favored, if dishonesty is equally beneficial to survive?

Self-honesty wise, back in the day,  wouldn't go with the Shamans and their stories and lies,  and self-deceiving yourself that you know them to be true, be better then refuting them and not uniting with your tribe/people on them.

At the same time, honesty to others,  could get you in trouble.  

Seems again, evolution favors both the evil and good. Where it suits us to be dishonest to ourselves and others for survival and thriving, we did it.

And where it didn't, it did not.

This a tip of the iceberg of the problem with morality and evolution.

If you live where you live and tell others about disbelieving in your religion would that be a risk?  Could it get you into trouble?

[Minimalist]

Self-honesty wise, back in the day,  wouldn't go with the Shamans and their stories and lies,

I agree.  I feel the same way about the koran.

[Brian37]

Evolution is a wild beast.

How can honesty be favored, if dishonesty is equally beneficial to survive?

Self-honesty wise, back in the day,  wouldn't go with the Shamans and their stories and lies,  and self-deceiving yourself that you know them to be true, be better then refuting them and not uniting with your tribe/people on them.

At the same time, honesty to others,  could get you in trouble.  

Seems again, evolution favors both the evil and good. Where it suits us to be dishonest to ourselves and others for survival and thriving, we did it.

And where it didn't, it did not.

This a tip of the iceberg of the problem with morality and evolution.

Ok, so without believing in Allah my entire life, I have had ZERO criminal convictions nor violent felonies. I am 51. I'd also bet most of the members here, the vast majority also have no major criminal convictions either.

Evolution is a field of science, not a religion. It is the scientific language used to classify biological life. It is true that both good and bad happen in evolution, but atheist I know is claiming that means we get to be lawless or have no empathy for others.

Just like Christians, unless morality is attached to your book and your god, it is evil. 

Ok, so this cat protected the kid because of who? Allah, Jesus, Yahweh, Vishnu Buddha? How did that cat figure out the kid needed to be protected?





And why did these Elephants save this calf? Was it Osirus, Thor, Zues who made them do it? Or was it evolution?





Our species ability to show compassion and empathy stem from EVOLUTION. Just like the cat, just like the elephant. And just like other life, it we are not claiming we always do, just that we ARE most certainly capable of morality, and we don't need a god to have morality.