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Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
#31
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 24, 2019 at 11:10 am)Jehanne Wrote:
(February 24, 2019 at 8:11 am)Yonadav Wrote: No, what you are saying doesn't make sense. There have always been non-Jews who worshiped the Israelite deity. Non-Jews who worship the Israelite deity are called Noachides. Jews are a little bit interested in converting people to the Noachide faith. We don't go around trying to convince people to convert, but when someone is interested in Judaism, we will frequently suggest the Noachide faith to them. 

We have always done that. It's biblical. A non-Jew's offering is to be accepted is biblical. Israel as a nation of priests is biblical. The non-Jewish man grabbing the corner of a Jewish man's garment and asking to learn about G-d is biblical. Judaism for non-Jews is as old as Judaism.

The Romans practiced a certain amount of religious tolerance, but prior to Christianity, there was little to no missionary activity on the part of Jews to convert the mostly pagan Romans to Judaism.

And again, the core concept eludes you. If we wanted to proselytize, there would be absolutely no reason to make up a new religion, since Judaism for non-Jews is as old as Judaism.

(February 24, 2019 at 11:10 am)Jehanne Wrote:
(February 24, 2019 at 10:07 am)Yonadav Wrote: I'm not a big believer in the historicity of Jesus. What I have said about it is that the account of his interaction with Jewish authorities doesn't make sense. It looks an awful lot like something that non-Jews might imagine would happen when some contentious Jew is brought before Jewish authorities, but isn't at all like what would actually happen. So from a Jewish perspective, the story looks pretty made up.

But arguments like yours aren't very compelling. It sounds like the reasoning of someone from the 20th century who thinks that someone like Jesus would have been in all of the newspapers and on TV.  The chances of anyone becoming widely known during their lifetime back then was incredibly small. Thousands of people could see you perform some miracles, and stories of your miracles wouldn't spread far beyond the people who had actually seen it.  Stories of your miracles would be competing with a bunch of other stories about other people that we have never heard of. A few might write about it, but the chances of those few writings surviving to our times would be small.

Jways was not the only miracle-worker of his day.

I bolded the part of my post that you basically repeated as if you were saying something different.
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#32
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
The only difference between a religion and a mythology, is that religion is currently believed, and mythology is a dead religion.
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#33
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
IDK that there's really much argument against the notion that authorities wouldn't notice a nobody-as-historical jesus, regardless of whether or not their comments would survive the passage of time.  In that context, it's not safe to assume that anything ever existed to be lost.   It's a non-question if that's the op's Q.

The other half of the implicit question isn't all that remarkable either, honestly.  Why didn't people notice a guy that did the stuff in magic book?  Because it never happened.  Magic books are still full of magic men.  This isn't unique to christianity.  In the time period you'd have to have gone a long way to find someone who'd never heard of hercules, a few centuries later most of the world knew samson.  Neither of these characters ever had an existence outside of the stories in magic books.  The fact that no one ever saw them perform any miracle wasn't an obstacle to that.
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#34
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 24, 2019 at 11:24 am)Yonadav Wrote:
(February 24, 2019 at 11:10 am)Jehanne Wrote: The Romans practiced a certain amount of religious tolerance, but prior to Christianity, there was little to no missionary activity on the part of Jews to convert the mostly pagan Romans to Judaism.

And again, the core concept eludes you. If we wanted to proselytize, there would be absolutely no reason to make up a new religion, since Judaism for non-Jews is as old as Judaism.

(February 24, 2019 at 11:10 am)Jehanne Wrote:

Jways was not the only miracle-worker of his day.

I bolded the part of my post that you basically repeated as if you were saying something different.

The bold part of your post is just utter nonsense.

P.S. If there were true miracles like those in the Gospels, such news would have spread across the entire World, both discovered and that yet to be.
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#35
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 24, 2019 at 2:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote:
(February 24, 2019 at 11:24 am)Yonadav Wrote: And again, the core concept eludes you. If we wanted to proselytize, there would be absolutely no reason to make up a new religion, since Judaism for non-Jews is as old as Judaism.


I bolded the part of my post that you basically repeated as if you were saying something different.

The bold part of your post is just utter nonsense.

You apparently didn't think so, since you basically repeated it as if it was a counterpoint, clown.
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#36
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 24, 2019 at 2:58 pm)Yonadav Wrote:
(February 24, 2019 at 2:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote: The bold part of your post is just utter nonsense.

You apparently didn't think so, since you basically repeated it as if it was a counterpoint, clown.

I agreed with your premise, just not your conclusion.
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#37
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 23, 2019 at 1:19 pm)Jehanne Wrote: According to Professor Bart Ehrman, Lecture 10, in his New Testament Great Courses series, modern scholars possess hundreds of pagan (non-Christian, non-Jewish) sources from the 1st century.  Why is it that none of these sources even mention the existence of Jesus?

For the same reason B.H. Liddel Hart never bothered writing about the tactics of Aragorn. Didn't exist.
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#38
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 24, 2019 at 5:34 pm)Nomad Wrote:
(February 23, 2019 at 1:19 pm)Jehanne Wrote: According to Professor Bart Ehrman, Lecture 10, in his New Testament Great Courses series, modern scholars possess hundreds of pagan (non-Christian, non-Jewish) sources from the 1st century.  Why is it that none of these sources even mention the existence of Jesus?

For the same reason B.H. Liddel Hart never bothered writing about the tactics of Aragorn. Didn't exist.

Once again, only one or two modern scholars subscribe to the mythicist POV.
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#39
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 24, 2019 at 5:38 pm)Jehanne Wrote:
(February 24, 2019 at 5:34 pm)Nomad Wrote: For the same reason B.H. Liddel Hart never bothered writing about the tactics of Aragorn.  Didn't exist.

Once again, only one or two modern scholars subscribe to the mythicist POV.

There's very little evidence for a historical Jesus.
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#40
RE: Why did pagans not take any notice of Jesus?
(February 24, 2019 at 5:42 pm)PRJA93 Wrote:
(February 24, 2019 at 5:38 pm)Jehanne Wrote: Once again, only one or two modern scholars subscribe to the mythicist POV.

There's very little evidence for a historical Jesus.

I agree, but I wouldn't really expect for there to be.
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