Choosing who you are

[The Grand Nudger]

Science assigns gender moron not personal want. Science/biology identifies male and female sex organs and assigns gender based on which of the two organs a specimen has.

Sex, sex is the term you're looking for.  Biology identifies your sex based upon those traits.  

Like wise science or again biology assigns race based on skin color.

That's a difficult claim to make considering how the gingers weren't "white" until about a hundred years ago, the italians even more recently.  Asians still aren't...but don't tell them that.......

I'm not sure that biology has ever assigned a race, and the prevailing academic opinion is that race realism is completely untenable.

Today, the mainstream belief among scientists is that race is a social construct without biological meaning.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/artic...sts-argue/


What I think is interesting, in any case, is that in this context of "choosing" ones race...if anyone is choosing it at all, it's not you. Other people have chosen your race. What race you are is dictated by whatever social construct is making the assessment, in this..at least, it's very much like gender. You're told what you are, and what you're meant to be - but neither of those statements has to refer to any biological reality.

I guess some of us got lucky*, we find ourselves in a social construct that affirms those statements we know to be true and comfortably apprehend about ourselves. An enormous coincidence.

[Drich]

Science assigns gender moron not personal want. Science/biology identifies male and female sex organs and assigns gender based on which of the two organs a specimen has.

Sex, sex is the term you're looking for.  Biology identifies your sex based upon those traits.  

Which is why I used that term in my orginal quote.. here let me embolden it for you so you can see it!

Like wise science or again biology assigns race based on skin color.

That's a difficult claim to make considering how the gingers weren't "white" until about a hundred years ago, the italians even more recently.  Asians still aren't...but don't tell them that.......

citation?

I'm not sure that biology has ever assigned a race, and the prevailing academic opinion is that race realism is completely untenable.

how do you have access to this web site but not the rest of the internet? or is your assumption that your intellectual limitations are that of the whole world? Meaning if you do not know it does not exist? Hey stupid the branch of biology you are looking for is called Taxonomy
, educate your self fool:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_(biology)

Today, the mainstream belief among scientists is that race is a social construct without biological meaning.

that's not true.
for example certain diseases only attack people of certain races and not others. so the study of those specific traits in said race are key differences to know and understand to creating cures and vacines.
Sickle Cell anemia is a big one. diabetes attacks certain races more than other as well as dementia and even something as mundane as lactose intolerance. for example all adult native americans are lactose intolerant, again it may not be popular to acknoweledge strenths weaknesses or differences between races but they do exist and are studied even if you can find a pop culture propaganda peice that says otherwise.
here is a list of racially specific problems, and race specific treatments as not all treatments even for a specific race is the same!!!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_health

Your problem.. you drank the PC coolaid thinking we are all 100% the same. we are not some are stronger some are smarter some are designed to thrive in given situations. you and people like you want to homogenize the species but the problem is science says you can't and have biodiversity too. You people also think that just because you acknowledge the race strength and weaknesses you tend to want to exploit it in a bad way. again not true. do people working on cures/treatments for things like sickle cell want to hurt or help black folks? at the same time they must acknowledge a genetic flaw or weakness only found in black people.

Which they can't do that if your artical is telling the truth now can they?

What I think is interesting, in any case, is that in this context of "choosing" ones race...if anyone is choosing it at all, it's not you.  Other people have chosen your race.  What race you are is dictated by whatever social construct is making the assessment, in this..at least, it's very much like gender.  You're told what you are, and what you're meant to be - but neither of those statements has to refer to any biological reality.

BS.. My mom and dad chose my race as did everyone elses mom and dad choose their off springs race. Now the classification meaning the cataloging of all of the attrites and weakness people of genetic similarity have is a function of biology/taxonomy

I guess some of us got lucky*, we find ourselves in a social construct that affirms those statements we know to be true and comfortably apprehend about ourselves.  An enormous coincidence.  

Some of us? dod white parent give birth to black babies? do indians give birth to hispanics as a rule? and only some of us are born to the same race as our parants? do you even listen to your own tripe???

We are each born into a social construct that affirms our identity and provides us with a construct or community of like minded and geneticall similar people... IE how black people sometimes refer to strangers as "brother."

The only time this Does not hapen is when a child is born of two totally distinct races like Korean and white, and lives in a time where such combinations where not celibrated as they are today... Then you have a child who grows up apart from any social idenity as they are reminded they do not belong with white children by white children and they are reminded they do not belong with the korean people by the adults!

Who among any of you has experienced a shunning not of your family but of your entire race? no all of you even if you are a racial minority have a 'safe space where you can be with people such as yourselves even in a prominently opposite race environment. I aside from my cousins and sisters, never once met another 1/2 korean growing up. but was reminded daily I was not white, black, hispanic, korean, and had to fight several people at once everyday I went outside just to have the right to be.. So don't pretend that just because you are not a racial majority you are here all a lone. you ass holes would have all shot yourselves along time ago it you where truly racially isolated and did not belong to anyone.

[The Grand Nudger]

Yes, please, quote yourself as saying that science determines gender while defending against the claim that you asserted that science determines gender.

Brilliant!

Almost as brilliant as arguing for race realism by sickle cell anemia, a wonderful example of how science does not in fact determine ones race, but that race is a social construct with no biological meaning.  

Sickle cell trait is an inherited blood disorder that affects 1 million to 3 million Americans and 8 to 10 percent of African Americans. Sickle cell trait can also affect Hispanics, South Asians, Caucasians from southern Europe, and people from Middle Eastern countries. More than 100 million people worldwide have sickle cell trait.

https://www.hematology.org/Patients/Anem...Trait.aspx

Sickle cell, you see, attacks those who posess an inherited trait, regardless of what "race" they are.  

If you want to waste your time bitching about pc koolaid, fine, but no amount of bitching about pc koolaid makes race realism true.

[WinterHold]

A transexual can -and has the right to exist and do whatever to their body as they see fit-, but forcing me to betray my eyes and  call a penis a "vagina" or call a cell mutation "normal and healthy" is -if you think about it- the enforcing of somebody's vision on me by force.

So if you notice that transwomen look like men then they are men, but if they look like women then they are women?

Or is it that you can see their chromosomes?

No; it's not about the looks. A man or a woman are a collection of traits; physical appearance is one of the traits, but so many traits exist and most are psychological and mental.
A male will not function as a female due to natural selection, their bodies will betray them, that goes for women too. It's not about the looks only; the looks are a mere trait.

I never spoke to transgenders  face to face

Not that you know of.

Believe me I'll know if I saw one

[The Grand Nudger]

A man and a woman are a collection of traits, but that collection of traits is not the same collection of traits that determine whether a person is male or female.

No, insisting that you acknowledge another persons existence is not in any way oppressing you. Complaining that it is actually does oppress them, though.

[I_am_not_mafia]

So if you notice that transwomen look like men then they are men, but if they look like women then they are women?

Or is it that you can see their chromosomes?

No; it's not about the looks. A man or a woman are a collection of traits; physical appearance is one of the traits, but so many traits exist and most are psychological and mental.
A male will not function as a female due to natural selection, their bodies will betray them, that goes for women too. It's not about the looks only; the looks are a mere trait.

How do you know this?

You don't even know what being transsexual means. It means that you are born with the mental traits of a different gender to that of your body.

I never spoke to transgenders  face to face

Not that you know of.

Believe me I'll know if I saw one

Believe me, you're wrong in thinking that you will always spot one. There are many transsexuals who can blend in and who can exist and function as their non-assigned gender without anyone ever realising. The trick is to transition early enough if you a transwoman before the testosterone makes too many permanent changes.

Your whole argument is based not on direct experience, or even knowingly speaking to transsexuals or learning about what the condition is, but about what transsexuals you've seen while watching porn.

[WinterHold]

A man and a woman are a collection of traits, but that collection of traits is not the same collection of traits that determine whether a person is male or female.

No, insisting that you acknowledge another persons existence is not in any way oppressing you.  Complaining that it is actually does oppress them, though.

What you're saying is true if we didn\t count the recent modern understanding of the human DNA, and how the male/female traits are literally written in our bodies.

Everything we are going to be physically is written in our DNA before we are even capable of choosing anything.

Everything our personality would become is shared between our DNA and the environment.

A male doesn't become a female unless they decide personally to alter their genes. Their personality wouldn't change unless they take the choice to change it also.

I don't mean to oppress anybody, but stating what genes are should never be considered oppressing to anybody.

---

No; it's not about the looks. A man or a woman are a collection of traits; physical appearance is one of the traits, but so many traits exist and most are psychological and mental.
A male will not function as a female due to natural selection, their bodies will betray them, that goes for women too. It's not about the looks only; the looks are a mere trait.

How do you know this?

You don't even know what being transsexual means. It means that you are born with the mental traits of a different gender to that of your body.

Many -if not all- of our psychological traits are influenced greatly by the DNA we are born with; this link has  some interesting explanation:

https://www.scienceofpeople.com/much-per...y-genetic/

For example, if I have a problem with socializing, I would blame a part of the problem on my DNA.

Being a transexual is going around this dilemma of natural selection, and favoring personal choice over the DNA. Thus, hormones,chemicals,drugs and sometimes even surgery are taken to battle the DNA choice.

Believe me, you're wrong in thinking that you will always spot one. There are many transsexuals who can blend in and who can exist and function as their non-assigned gender without anyone ever realising. The trick is to transition early enough if you a transwoman before the testosterone makes too many permanent changes.

Your whole argument is based not on direct experience, or even knowingly speaking to transsexuals or learning about what the condition is, but about what transsexuals you've seen while watching porn.

But what's the price; Mathilda? yes; you can suppress the DNA but it shortens the lifespan of the person; where I know is that trans people have shorter lifespans due to the drugs and chemicals.

Wishing to be a member of the opposite sex might be lovely as a thought; but it remains a fantasy for people who want change. Natural selection is stronger, and the laws of this universe are very tough -and written in our own bodies; too-. One can suppress their DNA instructions to the cells for a short period, but a relapse must follow.

I know that transexuals are only people who wanted to be members of the opposite sex. But I also know that I want to dive without drowning, and defying the DNA -as I understand it- is similar to plastic surgery: it witnesses a relapse. It's not as easy to manipulate like a computer software.

[I_am_not_mafia]

A person is more than just their DNA. Genes are just instructions. There is not a discrete mapping between genotype and phenotype. DNA is not like computer code. We're talking about things like different levels of hormones in the womb encouraging different areas of the brain to develop more so than others.

Nor is everyone either XX or XY. Some trans people have Klinefelter syndrome for example and are XXY.

The assumption that you are making is that a trans woman, i.e. someone born male and changes their body to female, has a male personality. The very reason for them to change is that they have a female personality but a male body.

Also you know that trans men exist right? That is, people assigned female at birth and change their body to be male.

You might want to re-evaluate all your porn-inspired ideas about transsexuals to take into account transmen.

[WinterHold]

A person is more than just their DNA. Genes are just instructions. There is not a discrete mapping between genotype and phenotype. DNA is not like computer code. We're talking about things like different levels of hormones in the womb encouraging different areas of the brain to develop more so than others.

Nor is everyone either XX or XY. Some trans people have Klinefelter syndrome for example and are XXY.

The assumption that you are making is that a trans woman, i.e. someone born male and changes their body to female, has a male personality. The very reason for them to change is that they have a female personality but a male body.

Also you know that trans men exist right? That is, people assigned female at birth and change their body to be male.

You might want to re-evaluate all your porn-inspired ideas about transsexuals to take into account transmen.

"Nature VS Nurture" demands being put here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_ide..._formation

Social factors which may influence gender identity include ideas regarding gender roles conveyed by family, authority figures, mass media, and other influential people in a child's life.[21]

[/url]

Our bodies are very similar to computer code because computer code was invented by humans who tried to copy how their bodies function into iron and steel. The goal of computers can be seen in the field of AI, but that's a different story.

Were trans woman/ trans men influenced to go into the change because of social factors -like stated in the iconic debate of the "Nature vs Nurture":

The social learning theory posits that children furthermore develop their gender identity through observing and imitating gender-linked behaviors, and then being rewarded or punished for behaving that way,[24] thus being shaped by the people surrounding them through trying to imitate and follow them.[25]

[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_identity#cite_note-25]
This is interesting. Yes I understand the role of nature in giving trans people a different DNA, but how different was it; really?

I really must know -and I'm not speaking about disorders-: but are transexual women/men are truly born like that, or did the environment change them somehow?

[I_am_not_mafia]

"Nature VS Nurture" demands being put here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_ide..._formation

Social factors which may influence gender identity include ideas regarding gender roles conveyed by family, authority figures, mass media, and other influential people in a child's life.[21]

Stop cherry picking.

From the same link that you provided:

A well-known example in the nature-versus-nurture debate is the case of David Reimer, otherwise known as "John/Joan". As a baby, Reimer went through a faulty circumcision, losing his male genitalia. Psychologist John Money convinced Reimer's parents to raise him as a girl. Reimer grew up as a girl, dressing in girl clothes and surrounded by girl toys, but did not feel like a girl. After he tried to commit suicide at age 13, he was told that he had been born with male genitalia, which he underwent surgery to reconstruct.[28] This response went against Money's hypothesis that biology had nothing to do with gender identity or human sexual orientation.[29]

Several studies have shown that sexually dimorphic brain structures in transsexuals are shifted away from what is associated with their birth sex and towards what is associated with their preferred sex.[48][49] In particular, the bed nucleus of a stria terminalis or BSTc (a constituent of the basal ganglia of the brain which is affected by prenatal androgens) of trans women is similar to cisgender women's and unlike men's.[50][51] Similar brain structure differences have been noted between gay and heterosexual men, and between lesbian and heterosexual women.[52][53] Another study suggests that transsexuality may have a genetic component.[54]

Research suggests that the same hormones that promote the differentiation of sex organs in utero also elicit puberty and influence the development of gender identity. Different amounts of these male or female sex hormones within a person can result in behavior and external genitalia that do not match up with the norm of their sex assigned at birth, and in a person acting and looking like their identified gender.[55]