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A Tale of Two Narcissists: Haggard and Edwards
#1
A Tale of Two Narcissists: Haggard and Edwards
I think I mentioned that I'm a fan of a YouTube channel called JCS-Criminal Psychology (also known as Jim Can't Swim); it's basically a webseries centered on the dissection of real-life police interrogation footage. And he's developed enough of a following that he's developed at least one imitator: Matt Orchard - Crime and Society. He recently released this video (which I watched three times the day it came out):





And I decided it was interesting enough to go on for quite a bit, and certainly on-mission enough that I decided to devote an entire new thread to it.

If you're familiar with his work, it's a bit of a change of pace, going from crime videos dissecting police interrogations like he's Jim Can't Swim's Australian pen pal (which, to be fair, Matt pretty much is) to dissecting the downfall of public figures who may not have been officially arrested and convicted, but who got caught doing something bad (that said, JCS does this on occasion as well although those videos are currently unlisted because JCS gonna JCS). In this case, Ted Haggard and John Edwards.

It was nice to revisit Ted Haggard's downfall, especially that little bit from Root of All Evil where Haggard dismisses Dawkins' expertise in evolutionary biology, and even has the gall to tell him "don't be arrogant" even as he says shit like:
Quote:I don't communicate an air of superiority over the people because I know so much more, and if you only read the books I know, and if you only knew the scientists I knew, then you would be great like me.  [...] As you age, you'll find yourself wrong on some things, right on some other things. But please, in the process of it, don't be arrogant.
When I first saw it, I was struck by the blatant arrogance and hypocrisy in that little spiel, and it stuck in my mind enough that I made it part of my sig on a long-deleted forum. (Dawkins has proven himself to be kind of arrogant, but at least in Evolutionary Biology he's earned the right to be strident.) The clips of Jesus Camp were also enlightening, since I didn't really read his encounter with Levi as another indication of his narcissism at the time, and I'm still torn between seeing it as passive aggression or a legit attempt at constructive criticism (maybe if he used Mozart as a positive example, it could have been clearer.)

And, as those of us who were following the news know, he got outed as, well, not quite the Kinsey Zero he insisted he was. Somehow, I never saw the interview where he strenuously denied ever taking meth, and then, when asked what he was doing calling him, he said "I wanted to buy some meth."

It was interesting seeing Teddy-boy struggling to adjust to a world where he was barred from his calling, but I'm kind of disappointed that Matt didn't mention that he's still up to his old tricks in the Colorado Springs ministry. Don't know if he's taking meth or screwing guys still, but at least he's got a lower profile than he had been.

The Edwards affair (pun not intended, but appreciated once noticed), however, is one I honestly didn't follow when it happened. I guess I was more focused on Obama to the point where I didn't bother looking into his scandal. But looking in-depth into it, I find myself wondering about a certain damage control strategy that I think might have mitigated the whole "screwing another woman while your publicly beloved wife's battling her metastatic cancer" thing: In Lars von Trier's Breaking the Waves, a man is rendered quadriplegic in an industrial accident. Jan (the man) convinces Bess (his wife) to find another lover, not out of despair, but because he believes that if she screws other guys and tells him the details, it'll be as if they're together and it'll keep his spirits up. It ends up working, even if she ended up dying as a result of a particularly brutal episode, but at least he somehow ended up ambulatory.

What would have happened if John Edwards told the nation that his affair with Rielle Hunter was actually his wife's idea, so Elizabeth Edwards could vicariously make love with her husband through Hunter even as her health failed her and she couldn't actually do it? On the one hand, it's probably going to be a tough sell for Elizabeth at the very least, and the Enquirer reporters who blew the whistle on the whole affair  might find some details that could contradict the story. On the other hand, it's probably one of only two possible ways for him to spin this whole thing as somewhat redeemable, and I suspect that just saying "we have an open relationship, you got a problem with that?" probably wouldn't have sit well with the political scene of 2008.
Comparing the Universal Oneness of All Life to Yo Mama since 2010.

[Image: harmlesskitchen.png]

I was born with the gift of laughter and a sense the world is mad.
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#2
RE: A Tale of Two Narcissists: Haggard and Edwards
(November 23, 2020 at 10:37 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: And, as those of us who were following the news know, he got outed as, well, not quite the Kinsey Zero he insisted he was. Somehow, I never saw the interview where he strenuously denied ever taking meth, and then, when asked what he was doing calling him, he said "I wanted to buy some meth."

It was interesting seeing Teddy-boy struggling to adjust to a world where he was barred from his calling, but I'm kind of disappointed that Matt didn't mention that he's still up to his old tricks in the Colorado Springs ministry. Don't know if he's taking meth or screwing guys still, but at least he's got a lower profile than he had been.

I think Televangelists are generally narcissists.  I don't think many actually believe what they are selling.  I know that real ministers have considerable doubt about many tenets of their faith, but televangelists just seem so SURE that God is real, because He sends millions of dollars to them each year Smile

Yeah, Ted isn't a Kinsey Zero.  But hey, zero and 6 are the boring ends of the scale.  Live your truth! Smile
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#3
RE: A Tale of Two Narcissists: Haggard and Edwards
(November 23, 2020 at 10:46 pm)HappySkeptic Wrote: I think Televangelists are generally narcissists.  I don't think many actually believe what they are selling.  I know that real ministers have considerable doubt about many tenets of their faith, but televangelists just seem so SURE that God is real, because He sends millions of dollars to them each year Smile

Yeah, Ted isn't a Kinsey Zero.  But hey, zero and 6 are the boring ends of the scale.  Live your truth! Smile

Of course, that's assuming that the persona that goes on the cameras is genuine. JCS has a video about Casey Anthony exploring constructed personalities.

It took a while for me to find a proper term for what his long-term affair with a male prostitute meant for his sexuality. Does this mean he's gay? If so, he was  evidently able to hold his nose long enough to sire five children. Barring a reliable  self-identification, I settled on "Not a Kinsey Zero," and I didn't expect him to give one, especially when it seems he's still not being candid about what happened.

... But then, trying to figure out how many kids Haggard has, I found an article about him from GQ where he said "I think that probably, if I were 21 in this society, I would identify myself as a bisexual. Just like you're a heterosexual but you don't have sex with every woman that you're attracted to, so I can be who I am and exclusively have sex with my wife and be perfectly satisfied." So, while I'm not certain that he's taken the Bowie/Jagger/Reed route with his bisexuality and decided to limit himself to women in practice, I guess I can take this as a definitive self-identification as bisexual.
Comparing the Universal Oneness of All Life to Yo Mama since 2010.

[Image: harmlesskitchen.png]

I was born with the gift of laughter and a sense the world is mad.
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#4
RE: A Tale of Two Narcissists: Haggard and Edwards
I am also watching JCS. Imo its awesome
Cetero censeo religionem delendam esse
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#5
RE: A Tale of Two Narcissists: Haggard and Edwards
You joined the Patreon yet? $1 per month and you get access to a couple dozen more videos that aren’t on YouTube. Not all of them, because they’re prone to removing access to videos on occasion because they’re apparently reworking them, but what’s there is as fascinating as what’s on the Youtube channel.
Comparing the Universal Oneness of All Life to Yo Mama since 2010.

[Image: harmlesskitchen.png]

I was born with the gift of laughter and a sense the world is mad.
Reply



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