No morals!?

[reverendjeremiah]

Ever hear that too? Not necessarily a Christian say it, but have you ever been told you don't have any morals because you don't believe in a higher being?

I cringe at remarks like that, cause they are so far from the truth!

All the fucking time. And when I say "I pick and choose my morals" they get even more up in arms. Fucking idiots. I have toexplain to them that they too are picking and choosing their morals.

me- "The bible specifically says to stone your disobedient children. If your son is a drunkard, then you should slowly kill him by throwing rocks at him."

Fundy- "no it doesnt!"

me- *shows them bible verse*

fundy- "oh...thats the old testament..that doesnt count anymore"

me - "so you decided not to follow this particular moral code"

fundy - rambles on and strains the discussion with special pleading on his behalf. Apparently fundies can pick and choose without admiting that they pick and choose. everything they pick and choose is EXACTLY what god wants EVERYBODY to do, andit is so obvious that it is true because everything else is ignored or insignificant.

[Minimalist]

fundy- "oh...thats the old testament..that doesnt count anymore"

So why does it 'count' for gays and abortion?

[Violet]

Let's say I state a moral no-brainer like "slavery is wrong". For the sake of argument, someone else responds "...according to...?"

I'll argue that position, and clearly it's according to you... so I'll instead ask "In what form?"

[DeistPaladin]

fundy- "oh...thats the old testament..that doesnt count anymore"

So why does it 'count' for gays and abortion?

Hate to role-play a Christian but because Paul brought bigotry against gays into the NT (and expanded the taboo to include lesbians).

As for abortion, neither the NT nor the OT has anything to say on the issue except that children are the property of their father and the father has the right to sell them into slavery or have them killed at any time if they don't show proper respect. Hardly a book that indicates that children must be protected.

---

me- "The bible specifically says to stone your disobedient children. If your son is a drunkard, then you should slowly kill him by throwing rocks at him."

Do you show them the passage where Jesus himself says that disobedient children should be killed?

[fr0d0]

Great point Rayaan! So good Sae managed to rep you 3 times!!

I would also say... that morality which aims at perfection has to trump self serving morals. I've known amazing people, not religious people, who are the nicest, kindest, and what I would call the most morally upright persons I know. Shamefully... the vast majority of Xtians I know are more selfish than most... but then they're just ordinary people too.

[Violet]

Great point Rayaan! So good Sae managed to rep you 3 times!!

I am unintentionally conniving. I once kudosed a post over 1000 times on a different forum.

I must have been a horrible child

[Rayaan]

One quick question though, my knowledge of Islam isn't to profound. Doesn't Islam derive from Christianity? or does it have a totally separate origin?

You may disagree with me, but I don't think so, because there is no evidence that Islam or the Quran was copied from other sources as some claim to be the case. There are many historians who have written about the life of Prophet Muhammad with a great amount of detail and accuracy in their biographies. And yet, no one was able to prove that he told a lie, or that he was hiding a foreign book in his house, or that he was being taught by someone, or that he went to a different country to get access to books from a library, etc. Many have acknowledged his great character and his humility. Also, just because there are similarities between Islam and Christianity, as well as Judaism, doesn't have to mean that they were all copied from the one before. I think that's a fallacy. But still, you're free to doubt or disagree with me with all due respect.

Great point Rayaan! So good Sae managed to rep you 3 times!!

Thanks, and yeah she rated me 3 times (though now only 1 remains), but maybe that was another indication of her crazy narcissism ...

[Minimalist]

Not to quibble, D-P but "Paul" (or whoever) was clearly commenting on the OT in Romans. Second-hand bigotry is still bigotry and the source is that vile pile of shit called "Leviticus."

[reverendjeremiah]

me- "The bible specifically says to stone your disobedient children. If your son is a drunkard, then you should slowly kill him by throwing rocks at him."

Do you show them the passage where Jesus himself says that disobedient children should be killed?

Yes..they pawn it off as "old testament". Then I show them the old testament ban against shell fish as an "abomination", and then show them the new testament were god lifts the ban.

They still refuse to admit that even their god picks and chooses his morals.

Well, it isnt god, just mortals "acting" like god in the bible..but you get my meaning. They still refuse to acknowledge it.

[DeistPaladin]

Not to quibble, D-P but "Paul" (or whoever) was clearly commenting on the OT in Romans. Second-hand bigotry is still bigotry and the source is that vile pile of shit called "Leviticus."

Points well taken but clearly, from Romans, Christians have always kept the parts of the OT they like and claim "fulfillment" to toss aside the rest. They beat us over the head with the 10 Cs but then when I pointed out Christianity is in violation of commandment #4 (they moved the sabbath to Sunday), Christians I've addressed seem find dismissing it as part of the OT. Their comfort with their own inconsistency sometimes amazes me.