Cucumber Dildo

[Minimalist]

I don't see how is a human life more precious than that of a cow for instance.

WE are human and cows taste good.

[Skeptic]

Don't be. Penn & Teller demonstrated it quite thoroughly, for anyone who cares to see, though you can find the information elsewhere, that PETA doesn't give a shit about humans. Nothing surprising. They're a nutbag ideologue group whose most fervent supporters haven no grip on reality.

I'm not defending peta (I don't support them) but P&T's show was a load of shit, like accusing people of wearing leather belts when they had no idea what they were made of, ridiculing people for not being overweight (wtf?) and calling people opposed to animal research hypocrites for taking life saving drugs that have been tested on animals.

[thesummerqueen]

Don't be. Penn & Teller demonstrated it quite thoroughly, for anyone who cares to see, though you can find the information elsewhere, that PETA doesn't give a shit about humans. Nothing surprising. They're a nutbag ideologue group whose most fervent supporters haven no grip on reality.

I'm not defending peta (I don't support them) but P&T's show was a load of shit, like accusing people of wearing leather belts when they had no idea what they were made of, ridiculing people for not being overweight (wtf?) and calling people opposed to animal research hypocrites for taking life saving drugs that have been tested on animals.

Um - first, get a sarcasm detector.

Second, it IS hypocritical to oppose animal research (and endorse bombing such facilities) when the medicine keeping you alive to eat your tofu was made out of, tested on, or otherwise involved in animals.

[Skeptic]

Second, it IS hypocritical to oppose animal research (and endorse bombing such facilities) when the medicine keeping you alive to eat your tofu was made out of, tested on, or otherwise involved in animals.

Is the bombing of facilities a major part of that? I oppose animal testing but it'd be a bit pointless for me to reject a medicine that could save my life because it had been tested on animals. It's not like the animal testing can be reversed.

Sorry, I still fail to see your sarcasm even after you've told me it's there.

[The Grand Nudger]

So we should grandfather that in? This guy over here gets lifesaving drugs but little Timmy just born today with some terrible genetic defect...nope, been a holdup on that research son, turns out mice are people too. Whats the score then? Humans, corporations, and soon enough...mice. Fantastic.

[thesummerqueen]

Second, it IS hypocritical to oppose animal research (and endorse bombing such facilities) when the medicine keeping you alive to eat your tofu was made out of, tested on, or otherwise involved in animals.

Is the bombing of facilities a major part of that? I oppose animal testing but it'd be a bit pointless for me to reject a medicine that could save my life because it had been tested on animals. It's not like the animal testing can be reversed.

Sorry, I still fail to see your sarcasm even after you've told me it's there.

The bombing is the most extreme end.

I equate these nutbags with the same ones who oppose GMO's and give absolutely no viable alternative to world hunger. If you oppose animal testing, what's the other choice? You gonna volunteer as a test subject? Let's be clear: these people would love to see you or a member of your family die rather than get the drugs you need OR further research that might help them or perhaps your children.

It's not my sarcasm - it's Penn & Teller's. They are being satirical because they find PETA and it's major supporters to be laughable.

[Skeptic]

So we should grandfather that in? This guy over here gets lifesaving drugs but little Timmy just born today with some terrible genetic defect...nope, been a holdup on that research son, turns out mice are people too. Whats the score then? Humans, corporations, and soon enough...mice. Fantastic.

There are alternatives to animal research, human cadavers are very useful I believe as well as computer modelling. There's a charity I support called Dr. Hadwen Trust that specialises in non animal research, they have some useful info on their website.

Of course, animal research isn't going to end instantly so there's plenty of time for transition to non animal based research. To assume that little Timmy's condition can't be solved without animal research or that it even would be solved with animal research is just an assumption.

---

If you oppose animal testing, what's the other choice? You gonna volunteer as a test subject? Let's be clear: these people would love to see you or a member of your family die rather than get the drugs you need OR further research that might help them or perhaps your children.

Yeah, when I die, why not? As for further research, see above. Just because animal research has been the norm doesn't mean it's the only option.

[The Grand Nudger]

Absolutely correct, of course. We're always looking for new and more refined ways to perform tests. Until such time as in vivo testing can perform the same functions however......

See, heres the catch, the idea that animals, as fellow creatures, have rights, and we should avoid harming them whenever possible is great. Except that to avoid harming them would sometimes lead to harming human beings (also animals), as is the case with prohibiting their use in medical tests. The very same sentiment used to protect certain animals can also be leveraged to justify harming them. Not so cut and dry.

[thesummerqueen]

Also, I don't care how sexy (or not) those cucumber dildos end up being - I like meat.

[The Grand Nudger]

To assume that little Timmy's condition can't be solved without animal research or that it even would be solved with animal research is just an assumption.

As is the assumption that it can, or wouldn't.