Cosmological Fine Tuning

[downbeatplumb]

Exactly. The 'finetuned for life' argument glosses over the fact that just about 100% of the universe appears to be lethal to life, at least as we know it. It's been compared to finding, say, one atom of carbon in a whole galaxy full of planets and concluding that the galaxy is fine tuned for the purpose of supporting carbon.

Hers a thought how would theists take finding lie on another planet?

Would this be an argument for or against god? you could argue both ways.

1: There is life on another planet, the universe teems with life so earths special relationship is null and void so no god.

2: Life on other planet is proof that the universe is 'fine tuned' for life therefore god exists.

There may be other arguments but what do theists think?

[Anomalocaris]

Would this be an argument for or against god? you could argue both ways.

1: There is life on another planet, the universe teems with life so earths special relationship is null and void so no god.

2: Life on other planet is proof that the universe is 'fine tuned' for life therefore god exists.

There may be other arguments but what do theists think?

For theists that "this proves god" is a forgone conclusion from any argument. This is why debating them is much the same as debating a tape recorder.

[downbeatplumb]

Yes if can argue both ways theyd choose he one that supports the impossible one.

[DeistPaladin]

Exactly. The 'finetuned for life' argument glosses over the fact that just about 100% of the universe appears to be lethal to life, at least as we know it. It's been compared to finding, say, one atom of carbon in a whole galaxy full of planets and concluding that the galaxy is fine tuned for the purpose of supporting carbon.

Hers a thought how would theists take finding lie on another planet?

Would this be an argument for or against god? you could argue both ways.

1: There is life on another planet, the universe teems with life so earths special relationship is null and void so no god.

2: Life on other planet is proof that the universe is 'fine tuned' for life therefore god exists.

There may be other arguments but what do theists think?

If #1 is true, it will only mean to the Christians that there's an entire planet with souls to save. I have little doubt they'll waste no time seeking to lead them to Christ, or kill them trying. That Jesus utterly failed to make contact with them will not even occur to them.

[downbeatplumb]

Hi DP not seen you for a while.

[DeistPaladin]

strange how cosmological fine tuning is an argument used often as proof of god.... but the fact that a penis can easily (for the most part) slip up an ass is not considered proof of a divine creation.

Cold, lifeless rocks floating in space = god

buttsecks = not god

I trust I'm not the only one to think the penis is a better "proof" than the banana?

"handle that fits into the human grip"
"outward indications of being ready for consumption"
"fits perfectly into the human mouth"

And hey, unlike with wild bananas, swallowing the seeds is no problem.

[Anomalocaris]

Yes if can argue both ways theyd choose he one that supports the impossible one.

Even if it resolutely supports only one conclusion, they would blithely insist it supports the other, and get some fraud to print something in some crackpot publication and use that to obfuscate the issue.

[DeistPaladin]

Hi DP not seen you for a while.

Thanks for missing me. I was busy enjoying holiday cheer with the family.

[reverendjeremiah]

When I hear "cosmological fine tuning" I immediately think about the fact that the universe is 99.9999% cold, black, lifeless vacuum.

If fine tuning was involved, then this fact is proof positive that the creator tuned the entire universe to not support life, and to reflect absolutely nothing (unless you consider cold vacuum to be something)

In fact if this is a creation, then 99% of it is cold vacuum. I can make a good guess that Black is the creators favorite color, that the creator loves extreme cold and lifelessness. How can they argue that these facts are not what the creator liked and wanted?

If the creator didnt want col lifeless vacuum to make up 99.999% of his creation, then he surely would have done otherwise.

...but there is no talking to these "Intelligent Design" people. Their arguments are all about "I'm special"...

If the designer didnt want disease then disease would not exist. The designer obviously enjoys the idea of disease, and that disease attacks everyone pretty much evenly. I think disease is a strong evidence of biological evolution... but if you want to think bacteria are the result of Intelligent Design then you must accept the consequences that come with that belief.

In other words, if you HONESTLY believe that the bacteria flagellum is strong evidence of an Intelligent Designer, then you MUST accept that flesh eating bacteria was designed to kill humans slowly and painfully.


flesh eating bacteria - product of evolution or Intelligently designed?

You dont get to say "the flagellum is an out board motor...it was obviously designed by god" and in the same breath say "god isnt responsible for flesh eating bacteria...disease and death came about through the fall of man"

So make up your damn mind..did god create this horrible shit or did it just appear out of nothing (apparently against gods wishes) when Adam and Eve were kicked out of Eden?

...or did it evolve to be that way?

[Anomalocaris]

If #1 is true, it will only mean to the Christians that there's an entire planet with souls to save. I have little doubt they'll waste no time seeking to lead them to Christ, or kill them trying. That Jesus utterly failed to make contact with them will not even occur to them.

Unless the 8 legged aliens happen to be inclined to cram the myth of T'Glook the radiant universal octopus up each christian ass and out their mouth first.


The efficacy of organized religious conversion efforts seems to be quite closely related to the military, technological, and economic power that backup the conversion effort. Given that statistically, overwhelming percentage of any sentient, technological alien we meet will be much more advanced than we are, and thus in possession of military and ecoonomic superiority the likes of which we can't even imagine in the throes of revelation induced fantasy, I give christianity almost zero chance of success in coverting aliens. Indeed I give christianity almost zero chance of resisting any efforts by any alien who is of the mind to force us to adapt a different form of stupidity.