Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: May 26, 2024, 11:48 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy
(October 4, 2016 at 12:29 am)Rhythm Wrote:
(October 4, 2016 at 12:27 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: How does what he looked like fit into the intentions of the writing (I'm assuming that this is speaking of Paul's letters to the Romans).
What were the intentions of the writing?

Quote:Should I assume that if a writing about someone does not mention what their face looked like, that they did not have a face?   That does not follow, and is ridiculous.  Where else do you employ this principle?
I'm not asking you to assume any such thing, no one is.   I'm asking why, you think, that much would be written about a man but not even -accidentally- or unconsciously include a single descriptive trait or defining mannerism?  What sort of man does or is such a man, how does it fit, either in the case of the proposed author or of the proposed historical subject? If the narrative doesn't include the details -of a man-..then is it even about a man? In what sense? Since it doesn\'t include those details..of what value is it to anyone searching for a historical jesus? What, in the narrative in question, do you take to be historical rather than legendary or mythical?

While I can't speak for certain about Paul's intentions (and Carrier is guessing to Paul's motives as well); having read the letter to the Romans, Paul's focus appears to be to tell them about the Gospel, to show that He does teach the same thing they have been taught, and to show them that he has something to offer them in this manner. Now the Gospel certainly does involve Jesus, as can be seen, in Paul's writings. However, the intention does not appear to be to write to them all about this new teacher. Now Carrier seems to make the mistake that the order that the new Testament was written, is the same order in which these accounts where told. However, many of these Churches where already established, at the time the epistles was written. They had already heard the Gospel, so the motivations about the letter, was not to tell them all about some new teacher.

You ask; what I take to be historical, rather than legendary or mythic. From the above, I would say that none of these applies. Paul's intention appears to be to introduce himself, and to give instruction here. It is corroborating evidence, that the Gospel and what it entailed was taught at this time, but not historical in nature.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 23, 2016 at 7:24 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Aoi Magi - September 23, 2016 at 9:56 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 23, 2016 at 9:58 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 1:56 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 2:38 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 2:25 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 2:55 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 2:58 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 2:56 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 10:44 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Angrboda - September 24, 2016 at 11:19 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 3:00 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 3:01 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 3:38 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 1:21 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 12:21 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 12:28 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 1:18 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by GUBU - September 29, 2016 at 5:43 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 29, 2016 at 9:02 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by GUBU - September 30, 2016 at 3:32 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by RoadRunner79 - September 30, 2016 at 10:10 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by GUBU - October 1, 2016 at 4:50 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 1:23 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 8:53 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 11:42 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 9:49 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 11:11 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 11:35 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 24, 2016 at 11:53 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 27, 2016 at 2:19 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 24, 2016 at 11:54 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by RoadRunner79 - September 25, 2016 at 12:06 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Grandizer - September 25, 2016 at 12:39 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 25, 2016 at 12:37 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by RoadRunner79 - September 25, 2016 at 12:56 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 27, 2016 at 2:27 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by RoadRunner79 - September 27, 2016 at 6:05 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 25, 2016 at 12:42 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by RoadRunner79 - September 25, 2016 at 12:54 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 27, 2016 at 2:29 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Vicki Q - September 25, 2016 at 4:51 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Vicki Q - September 26, 2016 at 4:33 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Simon Moon - September 28, 2016 at 4:32 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 28, 2016 at 8:15 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Vicki Q - September 28, 2016 at 4:21 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 27, 2016 at 12:38 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Vicki Q - September 27, 2016 at 5:46 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 27, 2016 at 2:22 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 27, 2016 at 5:58 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 28, 2016 at 10:02 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 28, 2016 at 11:28 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Vicki Q - September 28, 2016 at 4:23 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Mudhammam - September 29, 2016 at 9:24 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 4:47 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Minimalist - September 30, 2016 at 3:35 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Jehanne - October 1, 2016 at 7:43 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by Jehanne - October 1, 2016 at 8:09 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by GUBU - October 3, 2016 at 3:56 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by GUBU - October 3, 2016 at 10:30 am
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by robvalue - October 3, 2016 at 11:51 pm
RE: Richard Carrier - The Hero Savior Analogy - by RoadRunner79 - October 4, 2016 at 6:12 am

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Richard Dawkins prefers church bells to "aggressive-sounding Allahu Akbar" Alexmahone 12 1281 July 20, 2018 at 9:52 am
Last Post: I_am_not_mafia
  Poll: Christians, is this man a hero or a Grinch in your eyes? Mystical 27 3566 December 19, 2016 at 10:01 am
Last Post: Mystical
  The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins Czechlervitz30 22 3869 October 11, 2016 at 10:51 pm
Last Post: RobertE
  Analogy of the...Football? Aegon 1 874 February 15, 2016 at 2:09 pm
Last Post: FatAndFaithless
  Richard Dawkins Dies... Broseph Ballin 8 2076 August 15, 2014 at 2:20 am
Last Post: StealthySkeptic
  Amazing interview with Richard Dawkins and George Coyne Freedom of thought 2 1797 April 21, 2014 at 4:56 am
Last Post: Freedom of thought
  A Simple Analogy ChildOfReason 6 3582 November 7, 2013 at 10:13 pm
Last Post: Captain Colostomy
Video Richard Dawkins - Flying Horses & Splitting The Moon Woody68 2 2348 May 6, 2013 at 11:19 am
Last Post: Minimalist
  Ignore the hero - thank God! Welsh cake 15 4177 April 25, 2011 at 10:16 pm
Last Post: Cinjin
  Richard Dawkins applauds my channel + Help needed TheIslammiracle 2 1662 March 14, 2011 at 11:50 am
Last Post: TheIslammiracle



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)