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1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms

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1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
LastPoet Offline
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#21
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 8:24 am
Why has this dude started posting in green?

I don't even understand what he wants to discuss.
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LadyForCamus Offline
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#22
1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 8:24 am
(June 17, 2016 at 8:20 am)Thomas Kelly252525 Wrote:
(June 17, 2016 at 7:57 am)LadyForCamus Wrote: Wtf is this guy talking about?!  


LadyForCamus,

If someone said to you that someone isn't a Christian and then you worked to use The No True Scotsman Fallacy to show them how you think they were wrong to say that and then later you looked at the words in 1 john 4:1, do you think you would judge yourself wrong for working to prove what you wanted by The No True Scotsman Fallacy ?


Just saying, "someone isn't a Christian," isn't exactly committing the NTS fallacy though, Thomas. It's used in refutation to evidence supporting an argument. You are going to have to give me a more specific example than what you just presented.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
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Thomas Kelly252525 Offline
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#23
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 8:48 am (This post was last modified: June 17, 2016 at 8:51 am by Thomas Kelly252525.)
(June 17, 2016 at 8:19 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote:
(June 17, 2016 at 2:45 am)Thomas Kelly252525 Wrote: Is it wise to think popular logic is logical ?

We may discuss.

Thomas,

I think you need to describe what you are thinking more fully.   There seems to be more behind what your are trying to get at, but we can't know that.

RoadRunner79,

You may think how I started the thread was enough for a person with enough experience to realize what I was saying.


You may compare in an example below.

Christian says: That person who calls themself a Christian is not really a Christian.

Atheist says:  You are wrong to say that someone who calls themself Christian is not a Christian.

Christian says:  Have you ever looked at 1 John 4:1 ?
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The Grand Nudger Offline
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#24
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 8:53 am (This post was last modified: June 17, 2016 at 8:58 am by The Grand Nudger.)
-and then the "not a christian" responds with their own favorite cherry picked verse.

Romans 10:9.

Hopefully, you realize that a verse regarding evil spirits applied to the status of a person as a christian is a category error?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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LostLocke Offline
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#25
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 8:56 am (This post was last modified: June 17, 2016 at 8:56 am by LostLocke.)
You might think I'm crazy
To hang around with you
You might think I'm foolish
Or maybe it's untrue
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account_inactive Away
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#26
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 8:59 am
(June 17, 2016 at 8:24 am)LastPoet Wrote: Why has this dude started posting in green?

I don't even understand what he wants to discuss.

I was thinking the exact same thing.
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The Grand Nudger Offline
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#27
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 9:00 am (This post was last modified: June 17, 2016 at 9:00 am by The Grand Nudger.)
You can;t just -tease- with that one Bella

I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RoadRunner79 Offline
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#28
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 9:01 am
(June 17, 2016 at 8:48 am)Thomas Kelly252525 Wrote:
(June 17, 2016 at 8:19 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: Thomas,

I think you need to describe what you are thinking more fully.   There seems to be more behind what your are trying to get at, but we can't know that.

RoadRunner79,

You may think how I started the thread was enough for a person with enough experience to realize what I was saying.


You may compare in an example below.

Christian says: That person who calls themself a Christian is not really a Christian.

Atheist says:  You are wrong to say that someone who calls themself Christian is not a Christian.

Christian says:  Have you ever looked at 1 John 4:1 ?

See, that is getting a little better.  Your first post was fairly cryptic

There are people; who misuse or don't understand the "No true Scottsman"  fallacy.  For some, if what they say is correct, then I am also legitimized, in requiring everyone to refer to me as Dr. Murray (Though I have no such degree).

In actuality, I don't think that it is pertinent if they are or are not a Christian, and that Augustine's thoughts; to never judge a philosophy by it's abuse is more relevant.
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The Grand Nudger Offline
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#29
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 9:04 am
What you or augustine might consider to be abuse can easily be just some christian exercising their christian faith.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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Drich Offline
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#30
RE: 1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms
June 17, 2016 at 9:05 am
(June 17, 2016 at 2:45 am)Thomas Kelly252525 Wrote: Is it wise to think popular logic is logical ?

We may discuss.

True logic has nothing to do with popularity. it can be popular and at the same time a logical conclusion can be shunned.

So to answer your question yes it is wise, if the conclusion (popular or not) is logical.

What does this have to do with discerning a false PROPHET (not christian as you later point out) and a NTS fallacy?

Are you trying to defeat the logical fallacy? If so that is easily done in that Their are rules concerning what qualifies and disqualifies one as being a 'true Christian.' Where as their are no rules (aside from citizenship) of what qualifies a 'true scotsman.' The Fallacy points to a personal judgement as being the only qualifier as to who is and is not a scotsman, while a 'true christian' has to meet certain criteria as outlined in scripture.

Now that said, if you are not 'judging a prophet' by the guidlines set forth by scripture then you are indeed committing a no true Scotsman fallacy.
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Atheist Forums › Community › Religion › Christianity v
1 John 4:1 compared to The No True Scotsman Fallacy and sophisms

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