Lying to your children

[Erinome]

They aren't allowed to teach it in Metro Nashville public schools. That's where my son goes. They teach evolution whether parents like it or not.

My kids have it rough because they have an atheist mom and a christian dad. He can't take them to church anymore because "they ask too many questions."

[Minimalist]

Tammy Kitzmiller, et al. v. Dover Area School District, et al. (400 F. Supp. 2d 707, Docket no. 4cv2688) was the first direct challenge brought in the United States federal courts testing a public school district policy that required the teaching of intelligent design.[1] In October 2004 the Dover Area School District changed its biology teaching curriculum to require that intelligent design be presented as an alternative to evolution theory,

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all it says is creationism can not be taught as an alternative not as and addition to

Um, I suggest you read the decision.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/dover/ki....html#p294

NOW, THEREFORE, IT IS ORDERED THAT:

A declaratory judgment is hereby issued in favor of Plaintiffs pursuant to 28 U.S.C. §§ 2201, 2202, and 42 U.S.C. § 1983 such that Defendants' ID Policy violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States and Art. I, § 3 of the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.
Pursuant to Fed.R.Civ.P. 65, Defendants are permanently enjoined from maintaining the ID Policy in any school within the Dover Area School District.
Because Plaintiffs seek nominal damages, Plaintiffs shall file with the Court and serve on Defendants, their claim for damages and a verified statement of any fees and/or costs to which they claim entitlement. Defendants shall have the right to object to any such fees and costs to the extent provided in the applicable statutes and court rules

s/John E. Jones III
John E. Jones III
United States District Judge

Moreover, it is hardly the first case on point.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/edwards-...llard.html

[This is the text of the 1987 United States Supreme Court decision striking down a Louisiana law that required if evolution is taught in public schools then creationism must also be taught. This 7-2 decision ended any prospect of public schools in the United States being legally forced to teach explicate creationism. One consequence of this case was that some antievolutionists choose to use the term "intelligent design" instead of "creationism."]

The Supreme Court affirmed the judgment of the court of appeals, which in turn had affirmed the District Court's decision finding the Louisiana act unconstitutional.

Your school district is in violation of the law. Call the ACLU.

[Jaysyn]

They aren't allowed to teach it in Metro Nashville public schools. That's where my son goes. They teach evolution whether parents like it or not.

My kids have it rough because they have an atheist mom and a christian dad. He can't take them to church anymore because "they ask too many questions."

Kudos to you & your kids!

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Tammy Kitzmiller, et al. v. Dover Area School District, et al. (400 F. Supp. 2d 707, Docket no. 4cv2688) was the first direct challenge brought in the United States federal courts testing a public school district policy that required the teaching of intelligent design.[1] In October 2004 the Dover Area School District changed its biology teaching curriculum to require that intelligent design be presented as an alternative to evolution theory,

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all it says is creationism can not be taught as an alternative not as and addition to

Pretty sure the Adam & Eve myth is bound up in creationism.

[fr0d0]

How as a society can we lie to our children and then turn around and get upset about when the lie to us.

Life isn't black and white. What is more important... protecting your kids or telling them the brutal truth? I'd leave it to a mother to make that call. (I'm a bloke, I'd go more with brutal truth, but then I'm not qualified)

they teach creationism in my son's science class. an unproven idea and it's not even science why is it in a science class.

They're all theories with varying degrees of substantiation and should be taught as such. Teaching evolution as fact is also harmful.

With being a former theist, I yes lied to my son about the supernatural

How exactly? Did you go further than telling them what you considered to be the truth, or are you saying that in retrospect you were misguided?

I'm sorry but looking at in now from a free mind that is child abuse at a sick level.

I find your attitute now overly dogmatic, which is what I would guess may have been the problem in the first place.

Ideally your example should be one of reasonable questioning of everything... including yourself and your current beliefs... so that your children can see by example how to do it.

[Minimalist]

They're all theories with varying degrees of substantiation and should be taught as such. Teaching evolution as fact is also harmful.

Really? What substantiation does creationism have? Where is the evidence that your sky-daddy made the earth in 7 days 6,000 years ago?

The only harm done by teaching evolution is to idiots with their book of fairy tales and they deserve all the harm that comes their way.

[MilesTailsPrower]

If they kept religion out of the schools there wouldn't be a problem, but that's obviously a hard concept to grasp. The teachers are there to teach kids about core concepts, god is obviously not a core concept to having a career, now is he?

[fr0d0]

What substantiation does creationism have?

Very little in my eyes.

Where is the evidence that your a sky-daddy made the earth in 7 days 6,000 years ago?

None that I know of. What does your sky daddy have to say about it?

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

Quote:They're all theories with varying degrees of substantiation and should be taught as such. Teaching evolution as fact is also harmful.

Oh dear,here we go yet again: Creationism is NOT a theory in the scientific sense,in fact it is the antithesis of a theory, Creationism/ID is religious doctrine,without supporting evidence.

Evolution is fact you cretin..

My understanding is that IT IS UNLAWFUL to teach that doctrine in a science class in ANY US PUBLIC SCHOOL. Period.


Based on that post,the school in question is breaking the law.



PS Was that quote from our little Hobbit?

[IATIA]

How as a society can we lie to our children and then turn around and get upset about when the lie to us. This is I think one of major reasons of my decline in my faith. And yet this still goes on, they teach creationism in my son's science class. an unproven idea and it's not even science why is it in a science class. With being a former theist, I yes lied to my son about the supernatural, and in hindsight I feel ashamed and guilty about it. Letting my son believe in God, the easter bunny, santa clause, tooth fairy like they were living entities but screw humpty dumpty. I'm sorry but looking at in now from a free mind that is child abuse at a sick level.

A black and white world will never exist, so lying has 'levels'. If one is to teach or allow lying, then one must define the 'line'. Where is the breakover from 'justified' to 'unjustified'. This problem is not unique. It applies from morals to murder.

One has to deal with peer pressures. It is OK to allow children fantasies for childhood is short and life will come around and smack them in the face soon enough. A rationalization between 'good' lies and 'bad' lies might be to differentiate using story vs. lie.

When the children are old enough, you could tell them the truth and explain your reason for telling them a 'story' and that lying is still bad, but 'stories' are OK. Stories help people feel better, lies are deceitful and hurt people or make them feel bad.

[Erinome]

If they kept religion out of the schools there wouldn't be a problem, but that's obviously a hard concept to grasp. The teachers are there to teach kids about core concepts, god is obviously not a core concept to having a career, now is he?

Exactly! If people want to fill their children's heads with nonsense, let them do it on their own damn dime! I'm pretty sure that's what church, sunday school, and private schools are for...