(August 8, 2015 at 6:11 pm)Iroscato Wrote:

(August 8, 2015 at 6:03 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I personally don't believe that people go to Hell for the sole purpose of not believing in God. If I did, I'd also have to say that babies all go to Hell because they don't believe in God.

With that being said, I cannot tell you whether or not you are going to Hell. Or anyone else, for that matter. I can't even say if Hitler went to Hell. There are a lot of aspects that go into whether or not a particular person will go to Hell, and to say "[insert person's name here] is going to hell when he dies because he [insert particular sin here]" is simplistic, and not how things work. But it will basically boil down to those people putting themselves there, in the sense that they deliberately chose to turn away from goodness and love... and so they will go to the only place where those things are not present. Of course, none of us can know whether or not any particular person deliberately chose to turn away from those things because we cannot look into their hearts. We cannot measure this by simply looking at the sins they have committed.  

It is also not my place to speculate on this. I believe that job is for God and God alone, since He is the only one that knows all the motivations, intentions, sentiments, etc, of a person.

That makes you in the minority CL. And the fact still - still - remains that no just god would send any of his "children" to an eternity of unfathomable agony. The maths (not math, yeh fecking american pigdogs, you) just does not add up.
But I suppose the various verses about eternal torment are simply metaphors, right?  

I don't know if I'd be in the minority. While my opinion that they will not go to hell simply for not believing in God is my personal opinion, the Church teaches that it's impossible to tell who does and does not go to hell (with the only exception being the ordained saints who we firmly believe went to Heaven), and that the process of going to hell has many more layers and is much deeper than something we can paint with a broad brush, such as saying "all atheists will go to Hell for being atheist." It's a case by case basis and depends on many aspects of each individual person.

With that being said, I am sure there are Catholics out there who would say that yes, atheists do go to hell for being atheist. But they are speaking on personal opinion and not with the authority of the Church. They would be more correct to say "We can't say for certainty, but my personal opinion is yes." 

As for the torment thing, I absolutely thing there will be torment in hell. But the torment will come from being in a place that is devoid of love and goodness, and from being, themselves, devoid of love and goodness. Not necessarily from little red men running around and poking people with pitch forks.

I can't speak for other denominations though.

(August 8, 2015 at 6:11 pm)Iroscato Wrote: And the fact still - still - remains that no just god would send any of his "children" to an eternity of unfathomable agony. The maths (not math, yeh fecking american pigdogs, you) just does not add up.

And let me address this part. It's not necessarily that God forces people there, while they are kicking and screaming and begging for forgiveness. It's that people deliberately choose to turn away from love and goodness. And since God is love and goodness, this means turning away from God.

When people turn away from God, there is no where left to go except the only place where God is not present.

This is how I understand it.^

(August 2, 2015 at 5:35 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(August 1, 2015 at 7:29 pm)SnakeOilWarrior Wrote: It doesn't, because you don't.

You might be surprised.

GC

I'd be very surprised, if you could ever present some evidence to back up your bullshit.

(August 2, 2015 at 10:19 pm)Godschild Wrote: Deceiving yourself is not a healthy thing to do to yourself.

So, why do you?!?

(August 3, 2015 at 10:52 am)ktrap Wrote: Well scarecrow if you don't believe in the afterlife, then what do you think is going to happen, NOTHING!!!  Hence you will become NOTHING and BE FORGOTTEN.  Why is this hard to understand?

(emphasis is mine)

Why do you find this idea so frightening?

(August 3, 2015 at 3:45 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: I'm starting to understand why theists frustrate you guys on this board.....

We run into this shit in real life too.

(August 8, 2015 at 6:03 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I personally don't believe that people go to Hell for the sole purpose of not believing in God. If I did, I'd also have to say that babies all go to Hell because they don't believe in God.
With that being said, I cannot tell you whether or not you are going to Hell. Or anyone else, for that matter. I can't even say if Hitler went to Hell. There are a lot of aspects that go into whether or not a particular person will go to Hell, and to say "[insert person's name here] is going to hell when he dies because he [insert particular sin here]" is simplistic, and not how things work. But it will basically boil down to those people putting themselves there, in the sense that they deliberately chose to turn away from goodness and love... and so they will go to the only place where those things are not present. Of course, none of us can know whether or not any particular person deliberately chose to turn away from those things because we cannot look into their hearts. We cannot measure this by simply looking at the sins they have committed.  
It is also not my place to speculate on this. I believe that job is for God and God alone, since He is the only one that knows all the motivations, intentions, sentiments, etc, of a person.

Belief, belief, belief, blah blah blah. Do you have any scripture to back up this belief?

I know it is very strange for an atheist to ask for scripture as proof, however my question came with the presupposition that a hell and a god exists.

(August 8, 2015 at 7:45 pm)Shuffle Wrote:

(August 8, 2015 at 6:03 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I personally don't believe that people go to Hell for the sole purpose of not believing in God. If I did, I'd also have to say that babies all go to Hell because they don't believe in God.
With that being said, I cannot tell you whether or not you are going to Hell. Or anyone else, for that matter. I can't even say if Hitler went to Hell. There are a lot of aspects that go into whether or not a particular person will go to Hell, and to say "[insert person's name here] is going to hell when he dies because he [insert particular sin here]" is simplistic, and not how things work. But it will basically boil down to those people putting themselves there, in the sense that they deliberately chose to turn away from goodness and love... and so they will go to the only place where those things are not present. Of course, none of us can know whether or not any particular person deliberately chose to turn away from those things because we cannot look into their hearts. We cannot measure this by simply looking at the sins they have committed.  
It is also not my place to speculate on this. I believe that job is for God and God alone, since He is the only one that knows all the motivations, intentions, sentiments, etc, of a person.

Belief, belief, belief, blah blah blah. Do you have any scripture to back up this belief?

I know it is very strange for an atheist to ask for scripture as proof, however my question came with the presupposition that a hell and a god exists.

It is very strange.

No, this isn't something that is written in the bible. But then again, Catholic teachings are not all written officially in the bible. Remember though, what the Church teaches is that we don't know and can't tell who went or is going to Hell. The rest is an opinion that myself and a lot of Catholics share, but is not officially written out in Catholic documents. Apart from stating that we can't know for sure who is in/goes to Hell, the issue is otherwise left pretty open for members to form their own opinions.

(August 8, 2015 at 6:27 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote:  [...]They would be more correct to say "We can't say for certainty, but my personal opinion is yes." 
[...]

Well - of course. That is pretty much the only thing religious people should ever say, when it comes to their dogmas - none of which have ever been, nor can be reasonably expected to be proven. The problem is - the VAST majority present their opinions as facts, because the main reason for believing is not wanting to admit one's own ignorance.

(August 8, 2015 at 8:39 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Apart from stating that we can't know for sure who is in/goes to Hell, the issue is otherwise left pretty open for members to form their own opinions.

Opinions on facts? Your opinions are of no concern to reality. My opinion can be that the sky is green, but the sky continues to be blue.