And then, in the REAL world, god fails to n
make appearances, to answers prayers, and to respond to the evils committed by his followers in his name.

Same again tomorrow...

God's interaction with us seems to be inversely proportional to the sophistication of our recording technology.

He used to be really angry too. He'd have struck me dead for calling him a wank magnet. All I get now is a mild rebuke from people claiming to speak for him.

(October 30, 2015 at 9:47 pm)Beccs Wrote: And then, in the REAL world, god fails to n
make appearances, to answers prayers, and to respond to the evils committed by his followers in his name.

Same again tomorrow...

(October 30, 2015 at 9:51 pm)robvalue Wrote: God's interaction with us seems to be inversely proportional to the sophistication of our recording technology.

He used to be really angry too. He'd have struck me dead for calling him a wank magnet. All I get now is a mild rebuke from people claiming to speak for him.

I'm not picking on you two, or anyone else who discusses God, but I always try to avoid references to God. I will refer to the concept of God, but I want to be sure NOT to give the impression I am talking about anything that has been show to be real. Thus I will put "God" in quotes, by which I mean: ' The concept meant by most religious people, which they refer to as God, but which I have no good reason to believe exists in reality '. I also put the pronoun "he" in quotes for the same reason.

It is much easier to find fault with the concept, than to find fault with a, ( supposed  ), real deity - if "God" were really to exist, he is the boss man, the top dog, the all powerful can-do type of entity who made everything, makes all the rules, and can't be faulted. So if we find fault with "God" it's not "God" at fault but us.

So . . .

[ in the REAL world, "God" fails to make appearances, to answers prayers, and to respond to the evils committed by "his" followers in "his" name. ]

[ "God's" interaction with us seems to be inversely proportional to the sophistication of our recording technology. "He" used to be really angry too. "He'd" have struck me dead for calling "him" a wank magnet. All I get now is a mild rebuke from people claiming to speak for "him". ]

My intention is that I don't want to give theists the impression that I am conferring any value upon their claims that "God" exists. The idea is to show that the concept of "God" as proposed by others is ridiculous, logically unsound, lacking in evidence etc., and if real would be unworthy of praise, to boot. Fortunately, on the latter point, there is no good reason which I have found, to accept the reality of any such thing as "God".

Hence the fact I refuse to use capital lettering in reference to said imaginary being.

Quote:Christianity has such a contemptible opinion of human nature that it does not believe a man can tell the truth unless frightened by a belief in God. No lower opinion of the human race has ever been expressed.
-- Robert Green Ingersoll

(October 30, 2015 at 5:02 pm)sinnerdaniel94 Wrote:

(October 30, 2015 at 4:52 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Why is it that, as much as Yahweh wants a relationship with us, and as much as he values the idea that we need to do what he wants, it's US that has to seek him before he actually commits to us?

It's not that I want nothing to do with him. It's that I don't know conclusively that he exists, and the way he's portrayed in his holy book is not endearing. Gods having children is not a new thing there are many stories about people of divine birth, especially if you learn about Zeus. So someone being the son of a god isn't very impressive. Much less the idea that brutally murdering an innocent person somehow absolves a bad person of their sin. We have progressed enough as a culture that we don't believe blood has magical qualities, and that it's considered a breach of justice for a guilty person to scapegoat an innocent person.

It's not a simple thing. apparently the only way we can work this out conclusiely is if we die, or Jesus comes back in the second coming. In which case it's apparntly too late for some reason. which smells of a scam.

Listen, the way is simple and narrow and easy. God made access to Him as easy as drinking water. Your faith is accounted for righteousness and not your life long obedience. God made the terms and it's simple. His mercy is rich but there is a ceiling and after the second coming, it's too late; just like when the doors of the ark were closed before the flood.
Jesus is the only way to God.

daniel the thing is that you have to convince them first that there is a God and that Jesus is the way to God . you have to back up your claim that God exists and Jesus is the way to salvation what youve said so far isnt convincing that its true

(October 30, 2015 at 10:51 pm)jenny1972 Wrote:

(October 30, 2015 at 5:02 pm)sinnerdaniel94 Wrote: Listen, the way is simple and narrow and easy. God made access to Him as easy as drinking water. Your faith is accounted for righteousness and not your life long obedience. God made the terms and it's simple. His mercy is rich but there is a ceiling and after the second coming, it's too late; just like when the doors of the ark were closed before the flood.
Jesus is the only way to God.

daniel the thing is that you have to convince them first that there is a God and that Jesus is the way to God . you have to back up your claim that God exists and Jesus is the way to salvation what youve said so far isnt convincing that its true

jesus will however mow your lawn for 10$ an hour.

(October 30, 2015 at 9:51 pm)robvalue Wrote: God's interaction with us seems to be inversely proportional to the sophistication of our recording technology.

He used to be really angry too. He'd have struck me dead for calling him a wank magnet. All I get now is a mild rebuke from people claiming to speak for him.

It is exactly as if god's willingness to hazard any interaction with us is inversely proportion to the sensitivity and calibration of our bullshit-o-meter.

Either he is bullshit, or he is full of nothing but bullshit.

(October 30, 2015 at 4:42 pm)sinnerdaniel94 Wrote: Therefore say thou unto them, Thus saith the Lord of hosts; Turn ye unto me, saith the Lord of hosts, and I will turn unto you, saith the Lord of hosts. Zachariah 1:3 KJV

If you want nothing to do with God, then God will have nothing to do with you (hence, God giving people over to a reprobate mind).
You want to know God, then you turn to Him! According to this passage, He is faithful to turn to you.

How do you turn to God?
The only way to the Father is through the Son.
You cannot have the Father unless you have the Son.

Turning to God means to have faith in His Son, Jesus Christ.
Denying Jesus means God will NOT turn to you.

If you profess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you shall be saved.
For with the heart man believes unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Pretty sure if you turn into god you will turn into a murderer that thinks you did the right thing.

(October 30, 2015 at 4:42 pm)sinnerdaniel94 Wrote: Therefore say thou unto them, Thus saith the Lord of hosts; Turn ye unto me, saith the Lord of hosts, and I will turn unto you, saith the Lord of hosts. Zachariah 1:3 KJV

If you want nothing to do with God, then God will have nothing to do with you (hence, God giving people over to a reprobate mind).
You want to know God, then you turn to Him! According to this passage, He is faithful to turn to you.

How do you turn to God?
The only way to the Father is through the Son.
You cannot have the Father unless you have the Son.

Turning to God means to have faith in His Son, Jesus Christ.
Denying Jesus means God will NOT turn to you.

If you profess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you shall be saved.
For with the heart man believes unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

So in other words, don't bother asking God to reveal himself conclusively to you and to all the people around you. Just believe without evidence.