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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:08 pm
Aurora, let me see what else I can dig up for you. My Pinterest account is fullllll of recipes (I love food and I love to cook lol). I'll post some more of the vegetarian ones I've tried.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:10 pm
(January 14, 2016 at 6:56 pm)Rhythm Wrote: (January 14, 2016 at 4:09 pm)Aroura Wrote: So, after becoming aware of a number of facts over the last few years, and most recently learning that animal husbandry causes more environmental damage than all of the planes trains and automobiles TOGETHER (and checking that fact, and finding it to be true), my family has decided, as a group, that we are going to be vegetarians. LOL> you've been duped by Big Oil..how does it feel?
Quote:This isn't a huge leap, because we have slowly been reducing meat in our diets lately, but eliminating it entirely is still a big step to take.
We have 3 main reasons for doing this. The Pros:
1. It is what is best for the health of the earth.
2. It is what is best for the health of ourselves.
3. It is what is best for the health of the animals in question.
4. I want my kid to have a future, for there to be a rainforest, fresh air and water, seas filled with life and not dead zones and plastic islands. I want my kids kids kids kids, and so forth, to have the same.
1. Okay......I think that this is too nebulous to comment upon.
2. Not even remotely true, although it's completely true that most of us could eat a lot less meat, and different kinds of meat, and it would be much more healthy.
3. If, by health, you actually mean "extinction"...sure, I guess?
4. Your kid is going to have a future regardless, the rest...TBD, but it may be that meat production is the thing that ensures that your child has fresh air and water, seas filled with life.
Quote:Just a few years back, I was defending eating meat. I know that humans have evolved to consume animals. I grew up on a farm and helped kill and prepare chickens, turkeys, and even rabbits. But my views have changed over time, and I now look back on my old self as both ignorant and selfish.
Why...did your family engage in poor practice? Describe their operation?
(mind you, I applaud your decision to make your dietary choices a focus in your life, and wonder what those consequences are. Your vegetarianism hurts no one and is your own decision....but these clams above...another story.) You've been duped by a bunch of farmers, how does it feel?
Pretty was to make an insulting assertion. Ha!
Farm animals do not need to become extinct....just less populous. Vegetarians still need milk cows and egg laying hens, milk producing goats, etc. Thanks for the straw man though.
I'd like any example of how meat production could possibly be in any way responsible for ensuring clean air, water, and seas filled with life? That is like saying the way solve overfishing is to eat more fish.
I'm not trying to convince anyone else, but I find the immediate defensiveness of some people over my choice to be almost, but not quite amusing. I used to be the same way, so I get it.
Anyway, I was really looking for support for this lifestyle change, and sime new recipes. I should have known better.
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:12 pm
(January 14, 2016 at 7:08 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Aurora, let me see what else I can dig up for you. My Pinterest account is fullllll of recipes (I love food and I love to cook lol). I'll post some more of the vegetarian ones I've tried. Thank you, CL. I truly appreciate it.  I have pintrest but rarely use it, lol. All my recipes are in my head. I should find some better way to compile them.
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:18 pm
(This post was last modified: January 14, 2016 at 7:28 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
I -am- a farmer Aroura........
Make no mistake, our domestic animals would become extinct if we did not care for them. It's ludicrous to think otherwise.
Create a sustainable closed loop cycle between aquacultural waste and agricultural input. This is my business model. It works, and it's wonderful. I couldn't afford to farm any other way (and neither can the earth)
I'm not defensive over your choice..as my comments should have made clear, I think that it's admirable. I'm defensive over your completely baseless accusations (implied and explicit) in support of your choice.
I do support your choice (want some kohlrabi recipes?)...I don't support the fiction you chose to attach to it. It's counterproductive to what you and I -both- want to achieve. You with your choice, me with my model.
Put yourself in my shoes, for a moment. I'm -actually- trying to do something about the problems that clearly concern us both. I am being vilified by people who are -scamming- folks like yourself....and in turn you are vilifying me based upon their disinformation. The meat that I produce (and I'm nowhere -near- where I want to be yet...just set it up last fall), in all likelihood, is better for our environment (and better for us) than the vegetables that you are buying. It's difficult to see why people would stay in the market if they;re painted as monsters...and if their competition convinces people that their product is poisoning the earth when in fact it's the polar opposite. People can only take so much shit before they say fuck it and get a job flipping burgers that offers decent retirement and insurance.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:24 pm
Playing Cluedo with my mum while I was at Uni:
"You did WHAT? With WHO? WHERE???"
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:33 pm
(January 14, 2016 at 7:18 pm)Rhythm Wrote: I -am- a farmer Aroura........
Make no mistake, our domestic animals would become extinct if we did not care for them. It's ludicrous to think otherwise.
Create a sustainable closed loop cycle between aquacultural waste and agricultural input. This is my business model. It works, and it's wonderful. I couldn't afford to farm any other way (and neither can the earth)
I'm not defensive over your choice..as my comments should have made clear, I think that it's admirable. I'm defensive over your completely baseless accusations (implied and explicit) in support of your choice.
I do support your choice (want some kohlrabi recipes?)...I don't support the fiction you chose to attach to it. It's counterproductive to what you and I -both- want to achieve. You with your choice, me with my model.
I never said we should stop caring for domestic animals. Please stop strawmanning that argument. Milk cows and egg laying chickens still need farms and farmers, and I never said differently.
As to your super defensive comments (they may not seem so to you, but they clearly are to me, and if you are a farmer I can see why)...they speak for themselves.
And I'm not sure what fiction I'm supposedly putting forward?
http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?ne...pguBBUrKhc
I didn't mean for my topic to hammer on your job. But even if farming animals caused LESS greenhouse gasses than cars, planes, etc. it still causes an enormous amount, and is the top reason for deforestation in places like the Amazon. There is every reason to reduce or stop eating meat, and move towards humane dairy and egg farming.
If our population was (much much) less, I would have less issues with animal agrigulture. And ultimately, I recognize that the underlying problem is truly population. But food production becomes an issue when you've got this many humans on the planet. It can't just be ignored.
Please show me some studies that show how meat production is helpful to the environment? Even one?
Anyway, thank you for stinking up my thread. (Punt totally intended). As I said, I should have expected it. Everywhere I look for support for anything in life, I mostly find selfish cows. (More pun intended, how else can a person stay sane when dealing with humans?).
(P.S. Sorry everyone, I really am just frustrated. I was very excited about this change and looking forward to talking with other like minded people, and I should know better than to speak of ANYTHING publicly without someone raining on my parade.)
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:34 pm
Actually, just all fuck off and thanks. I think this is where I take a break from the forums.
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:41 pm
(This post was last modified: January 14, 2016 at 7:43 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(January 14, 2016 at 7:33 pm)Aroura Wrote: I never said we should stop caring for domestic animals. Please stop strawmanning that argument. Milk cows and egg laying chickens still need farms and farmers, and I never said differently. I'm not strawmanning you..you simply haven't thought it through. If you think that people are going to continue caring for their cows and chickens if they cease to be profitable......you are mistaken. They will die. They are not well adapted, they are well kept. Vegetarianism is no good for animals whose existence relies on commercial consumption.
Quote:As to your super defensive comments (they may not seem so to you, but they clearly are to me, and if you are a farmer I can see why)...they speak for themselves.
And I'm not sure what fiction I'm supposedly putting forward?
http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?ne...pguBBUrKhc
I didn't mean for my topic to hammer on your job.
Yes, you did...but that;s because you weren't thinking of people who do what I do, and I understand that. You were thinking of people who do the very things I;m opposed to, you just didn't realize that theirs was not the only model.
Quote:But even if farming animals caused LESS greenhouse gasses than cars, planes, etc. it still causes an enormous amount, and is the top reason for deforestation in places like the Amazon. There is every reason to reduce or stop eating meat, and move towards humane dairy and egg farming.
Bad practices are the cause for those things...not meat production. Vegetarianism does not solve those problems, uniformly assumed it will exacerbate them.
Quote:If our population was (much much) less, I would have less issues with animal agrigulture. And ultimately, I recognize that the underlying problem is truly population. But food production becomes an issue when you've got this many humans on the planet. It can't just be ignored.
Please show me some studies that show how meat production is helpful to the environment? Even one?
.......do you want me to show you studies that show bad practices are helpful to the environment? They don't exist because, because they aren't.
Quote:Anyway, thank you for stinking up my thread. (Punt totally intended). As I said, I should have expected it. Everywhere I look for support for anything in life, I mostly find selfish cows. (More pun intended, how else can a person stay sane when dealing with humans?).
(P.S. Sorry everyone, I really am just frustrated. I was very excited about this change and looking forward to talking with other like minded people, and I should know better than to speak of ANYTHING publicly without someone raining on my parade.)
By all means, be excited, be proud...I support you and your choice. I've already made it perfectly clear what I object to.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:46 pm
(January 14, 2016 at 7:34 pm)Aroura Wrote: Actually, just all fuck off and thanks. I think this is where I take a break from the forums.
Well, that's very nice of you. 
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RE: How to be a vegetarian? (And also, why to be one?)
January 14, 2016 at 7:54 pm
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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