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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 12:39 pm
(May 13, 2016 at 10:25 pm)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote: (May 13, 2016 at 10:14 pm)SteelCurtain Wrote: No, he's the racist asshole you want. Because he is legitimizing your racism.
All Presidents have been racists. If Trump can get rid of the illegals he will be the best racist since Eisenhower. There's more to running a country than solving one problem, especially when in the process you're going to cause ten others.
Trump believes in trickle down economics. He believes it's bad to tax the rich. I read this in his own book. That means the money for his wall is coming out of your pocket if you have a job and aren't making a telephone number salary yourself.
The god who allows children to be raped out of respect for the free will choice of the rapist, but punishes gay men for engaging in mutually consensual sex couldn't possibly be responsible for an intelligently designed universe.
I may defend your right to free speech, but i won't help you pass out flyers.
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.
--Voltaire
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 12:45 pm
(May 14, 2016 at 3:31 am)SteelCurtain Wrote: (May 14, 2016 at 2:19 am)Jenny A Wrote: We call ourselves libertarian.
Where is your candidate? Until that person has a name recognizable by more than 6 people, they are not an alternative.
If there were a viable alternative, I wouldn't worry about whether my vote would effectively be a vote for Trump. I don't know who will be on the ballet besides Clinton and Trump. Usually there is a Green, and an Independent with a capital I.
If there is a god, I want to believe that there is a god. If there is not a god, I want to believe that there is no god.
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 12:53 pm
(May 14, 2016 at 11:37 am)abaris Wrote: The problem is the majority suffrage. During the 80ies, green parties made it into the parliaments of most Western countries. Although their coverage was as bad as it is in America. The winner takes it all system cements the two party system. When it comes to presidential elections, you can just as well flush your vote down the toilet as voting for a third party candidate. The effect is the same. The thing is third party candidates aren't even on the ballot in all states, so even if they got full front page coverage in every major news outlet, they still couldn't win.
Third parties are allowed to exists to keep up the illusion of democracy. But the US is not a democracy. It's a republic.
The god who allows children to be raped out of respect for the free will choice of the rapist, but punishes gay men for engaging in mutually consensual sex couldn't possibly be responsible for an intelligently designed universe.
I may defend your right to free speech, but i won't help you pass out flyers.
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.
--Voltaire
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 12:53 pm
(This post was last modified: May 14, 2016 at 12:56 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
@The Steel/Jenny convo
Hey...did you know the Koch Bros were "Libertarians"? There will never be a credible libertarian candidate...the well has been poisoned. "Libertarians" in US politics are merely neo-con shitstains who desire a piece of the anti-establishment brand.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 12:55 pm
(May 14, 2016 at 12:24 pm)Jenny A Wrote: That last bit is quite true. It doesn't really leave me with a political name, unless I want to smash together socially democract fiscally republican.
Yeah, Jenny, but what does that even mean? Fiscally Republican. I guess there can be no doubt they're flushing tax money down the toilet as if there was no tommorow. It's only their mantra of being fiscally conservative and it's all window dressing, since looking at US expenses, there's no austerity at all. It's only the population not getting many benefits for paying their dues. Even worse, the first thing conservatives do is cutting social benefits while their other hand still forks out corporate subsidies and army fundings.
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 12:59 pm
(This post was last modified: May 14, 2016 at 1:03 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
-tiny defense of mah army.......The army says they don't want things, they are told "fuck you...you're getting them". It's just another corporate subsidy on a mislabled discretionary fund that uses servicemen and women for political cover.
"The army" is on your side (it's just a bunch of poor kids looking to make good, make a meal, make a bed, make a name), not on the take, lol....."The army" isn't even getting the funding...I had to buy my own kevlar skirt. They issued me a flak jacket from 1970 and told me to go clear buildings.........
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 12:59 pm
(This post was last modified: May 14, 2016 at 1:02 pm by Jackalope.)
(May 14, 2016 at 12:31 pm)Rhythm Wrote: I think that there are alot of us who feel left out, by these little political in-groups..or that their strictures are unwieldy.
I think that all of the basic necessities of life in a 1st world country should be taken for granted by it's citizens. That no one should have to wonder whether they make enough money for enough bread and water to keep them alive, or for enough of a roof to keep them from freezing. People tell me that this means I'm not a fiscal conservative......but they're wrong. I just know, for a fact, that we can afford to do that, lol.
^^^ This ^^^
...and I'll add that it seems absurd to me that anyone - and I'm looking at the Republican Party - can make a claim to fiscal conservatism while simultaneously supporting the ridiculous levels of military spending in this country.
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 1:10 pm
(May 14, 2016 at 12:55 pm)abaris Wrote: (May 14, 2016 at 12:24 pm)Jenny A Wrote: That last bit is quite true. It doesn't really leave me with a political name, unless I want to smash together socially democract fiscally republican.
Yeah, Jenny, but what does that even mean? Fiscally Republican. I guess there can be no doubt they're flushing tax money down the toilet as if there was no tommorow. It's only their mantra of being fiscally conservative and it's all window dressing, since looking at US expenses, there's no austerity at all. It's only the population not getting many benefits for paying their dues. Even worse, the first thing conservatives do is cutting social benefits while their other hand still forks out corporate subsidies and army fundings. That would be this part of what I said:
"Republicans talk about deregulation, but they appear to be in favor of deregulation if it benefits corporate America but not if it benefits individual employees or smaller businesses. They like protectionism, emimant domain for private gain, crony capitalism, and licensing to protect existing business in practice. That is what Trump's wall and 45% tarriff are about. But you are right that I wouldn't throw banking regs, environmental laws, social security, or a host of other regs out the window."
If there is a god, I want to believe that there is a god. If there is not a god, I want to believe that there is no god.
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 1:24 pm
(May 14, 2016 at 11:36 am)AFTT47 Wrote: (May 14, 2016 at 11:27 am)abaris Wrote: Libertarianism is totally laissez faire, geared towards the fairy tale of a self regulating market.
That's my understanding as well.
I think a lot of libertarians certainly believe this, but to be fair this is only one particular brand of libertarianism (I think this is most precisely "anarcho-capitalism", yes?).
How will we know, when the morning comes, we are still human? - 2D
Don't worry, my friend. If this be the end, then so shall it be.
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RE: Hillary or Trump: Which of These is the Lesser of Two Evils?
May 14, 2016 at 1:38 pm
(May 14, 2016 at 1:24 pm)TheRealJoeFish Wrote: I think a lot of libertarians certainly believe this, but to be fair this is only one particular brand of libertarianism (I think this is most precisely "anarcho-capitalism", yes?).
That's why I made the distinction between the American and European definitions. The American definitions don't cover liberalism very well. According to them, liberalism is left, while in other parts of the world, liberalism is in fact the ideal of libertarianism. It's usually about granting individuals the largest possible amount of freedom without any state interference. It's also about a free market, but not about a totally unchained market. That would be Neo conservatism.
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