(June 25, 2016 at 10:17 am)madog Wrote: [...]The EU is growing and has and may well include eastern European nations, Turkey, and who knows the nations the future may bring ...
[...]

What are you talking about? Who says Turkey is joining EU? Where do you get this stuff? What "nations the future may bring"? Martians?

And you're surprised you're not taken seriously? Stop fear-mongering already - your side won, for whatever reasons, you can give the bullsh*t a rest. If you feel the need to rationalize your (poor) judgement, then maybe you're not as pleased with the outcome of the referendum, as you claim to be...

(June 25, 2016 at 11:00 am)Emjay Wrote:

(June 25, 2016 at 10:17 am)madog Wrote:  Emjay said ..... "And if Bella is part of the LGBT community, as I am"


The ECHR has championed LBGT and every other minorities wrongly differentiated against by laws, rules of Public authorities and national Courts and numerous other discriminations in the 47 member States of the Council of Europe since the 1950's.

As I have pointed out the ECHR can not bring a case against the EU because the EU failed accession which goes back to 1974 after France, the final EU member state that ratified the ECHR ....

The EU is growing and has and may well include eastern European nations, Turkey, and who knows the nations the future may bring ...

The UK is very liberal, whatever people try to make out, but even if they violate a minorities human rights they have the ECHR .... But the EU has or will have some member states that are unlikely to be any where near as liberal as the UK .... They will be voting on issues that can Direct the UK to violate the ECHR .... and as I said the EU can not be ruled on by the ECHR ...

I have provided an example for the above, although the principle I tried to point out was not taken seriously ...

Okay, my apologies. I don't know much about how the ECHR works but all I do know is we need to keep it, but I've always associated it as part and parcel of being in the EU. You're saying that's not the case... and they're actually in opposition... or can be?

The UK ratified European Convention of Human Rights ECHR in the 50's ..... there are 47 members of the Council of Europe.

We joined the EU in the 70's and when France ratified the ECHR in 1974, pressure was put on the EU to accede to the ECHR ... it has been an ongoing promise put off and off .... they still haven't 42 years later ...

Although the European Institutions are not a party to the European Convention of Human Rights (ECHR) they did a fudge with "The Charter of Fundamental Rights" which became legally binding on the EU with the Treaty of Lisbon, in December 2009.

It should be noted  this is self regulation and they can not be ruled against by the European Courts of Human Rights

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(June 25, 2016 at 11:09 am)Homeless Nutter Wrote:

(June 25, 2016 at 10:17 am)madog Wrote: [...]The EU is growing and has and may well include eastern European nations, Turkey, and who knows the nations the future may bring ...
[...]

What are you talking about? Who says Turkey is joining EU? Where do you get this stuff? What "nations the future may bring"? Martians?

And you're surprised you're not taken seriously? Stop fear-mongering already - your side won, for whatever reasons, you can give the bullsh*t a rest. If you feel the need to rationalize your (poor) judgement, then maybe you're not as pleased with the outcome of the referendum, as you claim to be...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accession_...pean_Union

Yeah dude. Vaping. Its all that matters hahaha.

(June 25, 2016 at 11:00 am)Emjay Wrote: Okay, my apologies. I don't know much about how the ECHR works but all I do know is we need to keep it, but I've always associated it as part and parcel of being in the EU. You're saying that's not the case... and they're actually in opposition... or can be?

I looked it up, to be sure. This is what the wiki says, and it doesn't leave much space for interpretation.

Quote:The European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) (formally the Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms) is an international treaty to protect human rights and fundamental freedoms in Europe.

So, it's probably true that the ECHR can take up any case brought forth by any European, but it obviously means the four freedoms of the EU conventions and the human rights charta. If the particular state isn't a member, they can just flip their middle finger at the decision, since it can't be sanctioned under the conventions.

(June 25, 2016 at 11:09 am)Homeless Nutter Wrote:

(June 25, 2016 at 10:17 am)madog Wrote: [...]The EU is growing and has and may well include eastern European nations, Turkey, and who knows the nations the future may bring ...
[...]

What are you talking about? Who says Turkey is joining EU? Where do you get this stuff? What "nations the future may bring"? Martians?

And you're surprised you're not taken seriously? Stop fear-mongering already - your side won, for whatever reasons, you can give the bullsh*t a rest. If you feel the need to rationalize your (poor) judgement, then maybe you're not as pleased with the outcome of the referendum, as you claim to be...

All it takes is a quick search on Google... (nb, I couldn't care less about immigration, I'm just posting facts).

http://ec.europa.eu/enlargement/countrie...dex_en.htm


Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

(June 25, 2016 at 11:15 am)Allanon Wrote: All it takes is a quick search on Google... (nb, I couldn't care less about immigration, I'm just posting facts).

You know, I take that quote from the US ambassador to the UN in 1962, when the Cuba crisis was boiling. "Until hell freezes over". Turkey, as it is now, and as it will be in the upcoming decades, even when Erdogan is removed, stands as much chance of joining. It takes a unanimous vote to start the process, and that won't happen in my lifetime, if there isn't any radical change.

It would do you some good to actually look up all the different countries and factions opposing Turkey joining. Apart from the fact that they don't comply in any way, shape or form with the scripted values and freedoms of the EU.

(June 25, 2016 at 11:15 am)abaris Wrote: So, it's probably true that the ECHR can take up any case brought forth by any European, but it obviously means the four freedoms of the EU conventions and the human rights charta. If the particular state isn't a member, they can just flip their middle finger at the decision, since it can't be sanctioned under the conventions.

This is misleading .. no European nation can join the EU without being in the Council of Europe and to be in the Council of Europe you must have ratified the ECHR ... Only the EU can put their finger up at the ECHR ....

I don't understand what you mean by "the four freedoms of the EU conventions and the human rights charta" note I spent seven years against two nations, without a lawyer bringing actions in the ECHR ....

(June 25, 2016 at 11:11 am)madog Wrote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accession_...pean_Union

Yeah - fat chance. Not gonna happen.

Quote:EU member states must unanimously agree on Turkey's membership for the Turkish accession to be successful. In December 2011, a poll showed that as much as 71% of the participants surveyed in Austria, the Czech Republic, France, Germany, Italy, Poland, Spain and the UK were opposed to Turkey's membership in the European Union.[94] A number of nations may oppose it; notably Austria (which historically served as a bulwark for Christian Europe against the Ottoman Empire whose armies twice laid siege to Vienna in 1529 and 1683); Germany (chancellor Angela Merkel has long rejected Turkey's accession bid, and has proposed a "privileged partnership" instead);[95] and France (where some are anxious at the prospect of a new wave of Muslim immigrants, given the country's already large Muslim community.)[96]

Despite USA supporting Turkey joining EU - there's no way Germany, France, Austria, or - for that matter - any other country afraid of the next wave of muslim immigrants - accept Turkey as a member.

(June 25, 2016 at 11:15 am)Allanon Wrote: All it takes is a quick search on Google... [...]

Yeah, thanks. What exactly is that supposed to prove? I'm not denying Turkey would like to be a member, but there are no indications that it will become one in foreseeable future.

(June 25, 2016 at 11:32 am)Homeless Nutter Wrote: Yeah, thanks. What exactly is that supposed to prove? I'm not denying Turkey would like to be a member, but there are no indications that it will become one in foreseeable future.

Exactly, but the UK always had the yellowest of the yellow press, featuring everything between alien abduction to Turkey being on the brink of joining.