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Lucifer
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 (July 21, 2016 at 12:09 pm)Stimbo Wrote: As Hitchens said, "created sick and then ordered to be well". It's no surprise that the institution that tells us how broken we are also just happens to have the cure. Statements such as that merely show that Hitchens was in the habit of presenting interpretations of Christian doctrine unfamiliar to any Christian.  (July 16, 2016 at 8:02 am)Rhythm Wrote: I'm not sure what the endgame here is, convince us that god is a murderous psychopath, that christians are superstitious dolts, or that you're a compulsive liar for christ? All for the lulz  (July 21, 2016 at 12:42 pm)ChadWooters Wrote:(July 21, 2016 at 12:09 pm)Stimbo Wrote: As Hitchens said, "created sick and then ordered to be well". It's no surprise that the institution that tells us how broken we are also just happens to have the cure. Are you going to present an alternative interpretation based on your last few comments, or simply dismiss this one and give the impression that you had? Is it your contention that your religion doesn't offer up the 'cure' for a condition unfamiliar to anyone outside it?
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
RE: Lucifer
July 21, 2016 at 12:58 pm
(This post was last modified: July 21, 2016 at 12:58 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(July 21, 2016 at 12:42 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Statements such as that merely show that Hitchens was in the habit of presenting interpretations of Christian doctrine unfamiliar to any Christian. It's called an outsiders perspective. Generally thought of as a valuable tool. It's unsurprising to see you take issue.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
(July 21, 2016 at 12:56 pm)Stimbo Wrote:(July 21, 2016 at 12:42 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Statements such as that merely show that Hitchens was in the habit of presenting interpretations of Christian doctrine unfamiliar to any Christian. The original parents were created in innocence not sickness. Sinfulness is a self-inflicted condition. Beyond that Christians do debate the implications of general corruption for personal accountability. Hitchens quip ignores important distinctions and coniderations within doctrines of salvation such as whether or not accountability starts at the age of reason. I do think Hichens's quip could implicitly apply to the Calvinist doctrine of total depravity but ever there his use of the word "created" puts him outside even that doctrine.  (July 21, 2016 at 12:42 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Statements such as that merely show that Hitchens was in the habit of presenting interpretations of Christian doctrine unfamiliar to any Christian. Not to any christian, as I am sure you notice. Many have the doctrine of being born in sin and come up with a whole catalogue of no gos. Most of them something a normal being can't possibly avoid without getting neurotic in the process. Such as having sex. Hitchens oversimplifies, but ultimately the churches are the ones promising to have the one and only cure for simply being human. ![[Image: Bumper+Sticker+-+Asheville+-+Praise+Dog3.JPG]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-d-3rfdI7nG0%2FTerwtFyFXoI%2FAAAAAAAACak%2F7kFSmHeVrng%2Fs320%2FBumper%2BSticker%2B-%2BAsheville%2B-%2BPraise%2BDog3.JPG)
I'll grant you that Hitchens probably over-egged his remark, yet the point remains that the doctrine creates a problem and then offers the cure. 'Sinfulness' isn't a thing beyond the confines of the religion that spawned it. If I don't subscribe to the god against which 'sin' is a crime, how can I possibly require atonement for it? Real-world example: blasphemy in the UK is no longer recognised as a crime. A comment made the day prior to the law being abolished would incur a penalty; the same comment a day later would not. The comment remains the same - all that changed was the recognition of offense. Remove the recognition, remove the offense.
Remove "God", eliminate "sin". Problem solved, and not a shot fired.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
 (July 21, 2016 at 11:04 am)madog Wrote:(July 21, 2016 at 4:48 am)Godschild Wrote: God , the Bible and the church are all interconnected. It really seems you are quite ignorant of Christianity, so much so you shouldn't even have an opinion on ant of it. Because you can't coherently understand the simplet parts of Christianity. GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
 (July 21, 2016 at 5:59 am)Stimbo Wrote:(July 21, 2016 at 4:52 am)chimp3 Wrote: Your claim that these people suffered a gods wrath is neither supportable nor is it falsifiable. It is easily dismissed as nonsense. Really? What does it do? Bore them to death? (July 21, 2016 at 9:23 am)Crossless1 Wrote:(July 21, 2016 at 5:27 am)Godschild Wrote: Believe what you want to, I placed the truth before you and if you find it nonsense ... well the lasting result of that is on you. If you continue down this same path according to the Bible you will wish you had a wishing well at judgement. GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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