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There are patterns in nature, but the math is all man made. Period. Math is made to fit the situation, not the other way around. Numbers and math would not exist were it not for human philosophers who wanted to relate things to make generalizations easier to predict. These relations in patterns could mean a common ancestor, it could also mean that fruit grows evenly over itself over time. This does not lead to a god, or anything supernatural. Those conclusions come from watching fruit grow over time. No evidence here leads to god, provide the link and I will roll with it.
June 9, 2011 at 4:14 am (This post was last modified: June 9, 2011 at 4:16 am by Violet.)
(June 9, 2011 at 3:23 am)Andrastos Wrote:
Do you have a logical answer for the question I presented?
If not take care sister!
Would you care to extract the presented question from the noise... or am I to distinguish the flute from within the clash of drums, chimes, and a horn choir supporting a great brass band all playing different songs?
And also please don't abuse the word 'logic'. What the hell is a logical answer? I'll tell you: tautology. Why is the computer blue? Because it is. That's the logical answer. And it is almost certainly not what you are looking for.
Your happy-go-lucky attitude combined with your glibness will win you no friends here. Slow down, chill out, and never suggest that if one does not provide you with what you want that they are unworthy of your attention. To carry on with such rudeness is to ensure that venom, irritation, and brutality will respond. The route to oblivion is fast achieved by insulting the powers that be.
Keep in mind, lamb... that tact is important. And you will use this, or you consign yourself to mockery. The lions play with their food before they eat it... I would not recommend a lamb antagonize them...
(June 8, 2011 at 7:59 pm)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote: [quote=Androstos]So many rude people here!
Can I remind you, your just doing yourself harm by doing this!
You reap what you sow!
The simple law of compensation that most people are not aware of!
I agree that they can be rude. And you too. Hell, even I can be rude. We're not a formal forum until you go to the debate thread.
What is there to reap or self-harm to be had from their being rude to you? They aren't typically seriously rude unless they think you deserve it... and glancing over the thread I can understand them not treating you quite the best
Simple laws are usually so because they are incorrect
Bios are silly, nobody likes them. Except silly people
"What is there to reap or self-harm to be had from their being rude to you?"
Law of compensation is all emotional based; there is a lot to be understood about it! Express or project an emotion to someone of anger or hate in some way or another, or cause suffering in your wrong doing, resides on an automatic penalty on their Soul! There is no getting away from it, as soon as you act on your negative emotion, it is done! Same as stealing, murder, lying, cheating. Anything like that! There are two way to clear Karma, repent or the law of attraction will surely bring you the same event in due time!
Somewhat good to know actually, glad you asked!
wow you really dont understand their actions do you. we dont believe in a "soul'. an emotion is a reactive effective the body has according to its neurological state. nothing more
you really make this easy dont you. poor naive fella
[/quo
I understand! But I assure you in due time you will be spirit! In the spirit world! Touch, smell, feel, see hear more so than you can now! Actually most spirits say they feel more real than on earth!
haha .....sorry that made me laugh out loud and I'm working so please warn of such humor in the future. I have read all of Hawking's books of the later decade and i entrust his theories to be of the most trustworthy of our time. PLEASE dont ask questions you dont want to hear the answer to because its clear your sensitive and dont like our agnostic answers.
Hawking's wrote "that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark," there are many metaphors for "the dark" do you think he is referring to the non-presence of light? or ones own "darkness" he writes alot more than you can read into, not your fault due to your blinding faith but a problem none the less. if a man can splice to an atom, or separate neurons, or change a genetic defection in an unborn fetus than you must realise we are here with much more purpose than to read, obey and devote. please understand its you we sorrow for..
Let me tell you something, the people that REALLY know what’s going on in our universe, are the most humble ones, and so they have nothing to prove!
To be frank his theory for everything is nothing short of stupidity! It's impossible! I can tell you that now!
When he dies and pass into the spirit world as we ALL do, not sure how he is going to feel actually, especially after making such claims as he is now! With NOTHING to back it up!
He has no idea of the damage he is doing by making such claims! Especially when all he's followers believe his words!
I will give you a heads up now, when you pass you’re going to find yourself so inundated with info you’re going to be overwhelmed, info upon info upon info upon info upon info, and I’ll tell you now what your conclusion will be! There must be a God! That will prop be the same time you will grasp what infinite means!
There is atheist doing this for thousands of years! With nothing to show, but more info! Because they need proof! But little do they know they can find proof by doing the greatest experiment one can do, and that is within!
I'll give you some Logic! If you want to know something about any sort of creation, the fastest way to come to know the truth about that creation is to ask the creator of it!
Quote:I think you may be missing the point OGN, of course mathematics would not be possible without anyone to do it, but the mathematical relationships and constants we see in nature would still exist even if people were not around to describe them is the point being made I believe. Somebody please correct me if I am wrong though.
Erm, he said that mathematics is independant of experience. This is incorrect. That's the friggin point. And he is incorrect in his claim that the patterns we see in nature are based on math. Mathematics is a human construct, not a nature construct. We devise and use mathematics to analyze and understand nature. So the math is based on what we see in nature, NOT the other way around.
'The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and seal. It could not be expressed better.'
-- Samuel "Mark Twain" Clemens
"I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the scriptures, but with experiments, demonstrations, and observations".
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
"In short, Meyer has shown that his first disastrous book was not a fluke: he is capable of going into any field in which he has no training or research experience and botching it just as badly as he did molecular biology. As I've written before, if you are a complete amateur and don't understand a subject, don't demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect by writing a book about it and proving your ignorance to everyone else! "
MMM well I really don't know what to say! His words here and his words in his Bio don't match!
I can only say he is in for a big BIG shock! Same goes for anybody that believes this to be true!
And I suppose most people will only come to realize this when they do pass!
Actually God built everyone with the desire for eternal life, (because its true) only one's emotional damage will overcome this desire!
Personally, I really feel sorrow for anybody that would believe this!
What do you believe? If you don't mind me asking!
Afraid of death are we? You fear going to sleep and never waking up? Perhaps it's you who will be surprised. Then again you couldn't because you'll be dead.
Quote:I can only say he is in for a big BIG shock! Same goes for anybody that believes this to be true!
I sense fear in you. You are afraid to die aren't you?
If you strongly desire to live forever, then I guess death is something to fear. It's the natural cycle of life my friend. Fight it you cannot. We can only prolong death, not stop it. You can only hope and believe in a heaven, never will you be there.
If belief in such a place gives you comfort then, go for it.
Quote:Actually God built everyone with the desire for eternal life,
God had nothing to do with it. Because we are aware of ourselves unlike other animals on this planet, we come to understand that we will die someday, we know this because of all the people we see go, that elderly man that passed away will be you one day. I can see why many fear this. We lust to hold on to this existence but it is futile. This existence is tempery. We will have to give it up eventually.
I see this existence as a chance for the cosmos to look at itself.
Quote:Personally, I really feel sorrow for anybody that would believe this!
Why? Because some people aren't afraid to look at death and see it for what it really is? The end of you?
We are nothing but biological beings, the nature of biological beings is to live, reproduce....and die.
I think you are filled with fear when it comes to reality. So you hide yourself from it through religious beliefs.
Quote:What do you believe? If you don't mind me asking!
I don't believe in god, afterlife, souls, spirits, angles, demons, ect ect.
Nothing religious.
I want to see reality for what it really is. To see and understand what it means to die.
Death isn't so bad, you won't even be aware that you're dead. Time and space will no longer have any meaning to you. You will be beyond such things. Billions of years would past, and you'll notice nothing.
Once you're brains shuts down, you're done.
Someday you may accept this, but until then you can hold on to your cuddly bear for comfort.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
June 9, 2011 at 4:38 am (This post was last modified: June 9, 2011 at 4:58 am by Andrastos.)
(June 9, 2011 at 4:25 am)Andrastos Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 9:38 pm)aidoism Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 9:29 pm)Andrastos Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 8:43 pm)aidoism Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 8:37 pm)Andrastos Wrote: I agree that they can be rude. And you too. Hell, even I can be rude. We're not a formal forum until you go to the debate thread.
What is there to reap or self-harm to be had from their being rude to you? They aren't typically seriously rude unless they think you deserve it... and glancing over the thread I can understand them not treating you quite the best
Simple laws are usually so because they are incorrect
Bios are silly, nobody likes them. Except silly people
"What is there to reap or self-harm to be had from their being rude to you?"
Law of compensation is all emotional based; there is a lot to be understood about it! Express or project an emotion to someone of anger or hate in some way or another, or cause suffering in your wrong doing, resides on an automatic penalty on their Soul! There is no getting away from it, as soon as you act on your negative emotion, it is done! Same as stealing, murder, lying, cheating. Anything like that! There are two way to clear Karma, repent or the law of attraction will surely bring you the same event in due time!
Somewhat good to know actually, glad you asked!
wow you really dont understand their actions do you. we dont believe in a "soul'. an emotion is a reactive effective the body has according to its neurological state. nothing more
you really make this easy dont you. poor naive fella
[/quo
I understand! But I assure you in due time you will be spirit! In the spirit world! Touch, smell, feel, see hear more so than you can now! Actually most spirits say they feel more real than on earth!
haha .....sorry that made me laugh out loud and I'm working so please warn of such humor in the future. I have read all of Hawking's books of the later decade and i entrust his theories to be of the most trustworthy of our time. PLEASE dont ask questions you dont want to hear the answer to because its clear your sensitive and dont like our agnostic answers.
Hawking's wrote "that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark," there are many metaphors for "the dark" do you think he is referring to the non-presence of light? or ones own "darkness" he writes alot more than you can read into, not your fault due to your blinding faith but a problem none the less. if a man can splice to an atom, or separate neurons, or change a genetic defection in an unborn fetus than you must realise we are here with much more purpose than to read, obey and devote. please understand its you we sorrow for..
Let me tell you something, the people that REALLY know what’s going on in our universe, are the most humble ones, and so they have nothing to prove!
To be frank his theory for everything is nothing short of stupidity! It's impossible! I can tell you that now!
When he dies and pass into the spirit world as we ALL do, not sure how he is going to feel actually, especially after making such claims as he is now! With NOTHING to back it up!
He has no idea of the damage he is doing by making such claims! Especially when all he's followers believe his words!
I will give you a heads up now, when you pass you’re going to find yourself so inundated with info you’re going to be overwhelmed, info upon info upon info upon info upon info, and I’ll tell you now what your conclusion will be! There must be a God! That will prop be the same time you will grasp what infinite means!
There is atheist doing this for thousands of years! With nothing to show, but more info! Because they need proof! But little do they know they can find proof by doing the greatest experiment one can do, and that is within!
I'll give you some Logic! If you want to know something about any sort of creation, the fastest way to come to know the truth about that creation is to ask the creator of it!
I can give you a quick brif on black holes now if you like? and then when you pass you can verify it!
(June 9, 2011 at 4:33 am)Ace Otana Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 9:12 pm)Andrastos Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 8:17 pm)Epimethean Wrote: Andrastos:
MMM well I really don't know what to say! His words here and his words in his Bio don't match!
I can only say he is in for a big BIG shock! Same goes for anybody that believes this to be true!
And I suppose most people will only come to realize this when they do pass!
Actually God built everyone with the desire for eternal life, (because its true) only one's emotional damage will overcome this desire!
Personally, I really feel sorrow for anybody that would believe this!
What do you believe? If you don't mind me asking!
Afraid of death are we? You fear going to sleep and never waking up? Perhaps it's you who will be surprised. Then again you couldn't because you'll be dead.
Quote:I can only say he is in for a big BIG shock! Same goes for anybody that believes this to be true!
I sense fear in you. You are afraid to die aren't you?
If you strongly desire to live forever, then I guess death is something to fear. It's the natural cycle of life my friend. Fight it you cannot. We can only prolong death, not stop it. You can only hope and believe in a heaven, never will you be there.
If belief in such a place gives you comfort then, go for it.
Quote:Actually God built everyone with the desire for eternal life,
God had nothing to do with it. Because we are aware of ourselves unlike other animals on this planet, we come to understand that we will die someday, we know this because of all the people we see go, that elderly man that passed away will be you one day. I can see why many fear this. We lust to hold on to this existence but it is futile. This existence is tempery. We will have to give it up eventually.
I see this existence as a chance for the cosmos to look at itself.
Quote:Personally, I really feel sorrow for anybody that would believe this!
Why? Because some people aren't afraid to look at death and see it for what it really is? The end of you?
We are nothing but biological beings, the nature of biological beings is to live, reproduce....and die.
I think you are filled with fear when it comes to reality. So you hide yourself from it through religious beliefs.
Quote:What do you believe? If you don't mind me asking!
I don't believe in god, afterlife, souls, spirits, angles, demons, ect ect.
Nothing religious.
I want to see reality for what it really is. To see and understand what it means to die.
Death isn't so bad, you won't even be aware that you're dead. Time and space will no longer have any meaning to you. You will be beyond such things. Billions of years would past, and you'll notice nothing.
Once you're brains shuts down, you're done.
Someday you may accept this, but until then you can hold on to your cuddly bear for comfort.
(June 9, 2011 at 4:25 am)Andrastos Wrote: Let me tell you something, the people that REALLY know what’s going on in our universe, are the most humble ones, and so they have nothing to prove!
Then you know nothing of the universe as all you have proven so far is that you are an arrogant jerk.
Andrastos Wrote:To be frank his theory for everything is nothing short of stupidity! It's impossible! I can tell you that now!
When he dies and pass into the spirit world as we ALL do, not sure how he is going to feel actually, especially after making such claims as he is now! With NOTHING to back it up!
Hmm...an argument with nothing to back it up, where have I seen that recently?
Andrastos Wrote:He has no idea of the damage he is doing by making such claims! Especially when all he's followers believe his words!
I will give you a heads up now, when you pass you’re going to find yourself so inundated with info you’re going to be overwhelmed, info upon info upon info upon info upon info, and I’ll tell you now what your conclusion will be! There must be a God! That will prop be the same time you will grasp what infinite means!
There is atheist doing this for thousands of years! With nothing to show, but more info! Because they need proof! But little do they know they can find proof by doing the greatest experiment one can do, and that is within!
I will give you a heads up. When you die, you become worm food. You so badly need for there to be something more that you will believe anything to comfort you.
Andrastos Wrote:I'll give you some Logic! If you want to know something about any sort of creation, the fastest way to come to know the truth about that creation is to ask the creator of it!
Then ask the creator this, "Dear God, why did you send such a dumbass to spread your word?"
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
(June 9, 2011 at 4:38 am)Andrastos Wrote: Ok, hope you lilke suprises!
That's right, you keep holding onto that teddy bear.
The reality of death is unavoidable.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
June 9, 2011 at 5:15 am (This post was last modified: June 9, 2011 at 5:54 am by Andrastos.)
(June 9, 2011 at 5:15 am)Andrastos Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 3:57 pm)Napoleon666 Wrote:
Wow funny shit, keep it coming
(June 8, 2011 at 3:56 pm)Andrastos Wrote:
(June 8, 2011 at 3:52 pm)LastPoet Wrote: And the proof towards any god was....?
Actually I think I know more about evolution than you do!
Hahahahaah Lol WUT! ^
I'll answer this in latter posts, when I answer somethings about black holes, same subject!
Actually I'll do it now!
Black Holes and evolution!
This is new info to me and I only know a little, but i'll tell you what I know!
We all know the largest black hole to us is at the centre of our Galaxy!
There are also smaller ones in the swirls!
They hold our Galaxy together like the sun does for our solar system together!
They not only suck energy and mass in but they also breathe energy out!
The primary energy coming from them is Gods creative energy!
This energy intensifies exponentially every (13000-26000 years) not too sure about the time actually!
Every time this happen there is a jump in "evolution" all creatures take the next step up! For example soft bodied creatures will suddenly have exoskeleton and so on throughout the eons!
Why the jump? God is efficient in everything she does,
When is the next one due 2012-2013
If you understand exponential, I tell you now things are just starting to really ramp up! That’s why crazy things are going on in our magnetosphere ATM!
Will a prickly pear still be prickly? No one knows what is going to happen!
The Mayans have a galactic calendar that predicts this event! It is still more accurate than our and it’s thousands of years old! They were smart buggers back then!
This is common knowledge in the spirit world and there is great excitement, most humans don't have a clue!
That’s all I know!
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