Thanks for the correction, Tazz.

(November 18, 2016 at 9:28 pm)Stimbo Wrote:

(November 18, 2016 at 10:24 am)Drich Wrote: ...And quotes from others, shows signs of an empty one.

~Drich~

That's what we've been trying to tell you every time you pop out a bible quote.

So then is it any different when you pop out a meme or some other persons words?

An African-American ran the United States for 8 years and did a pretty good job of it, in spite of his blackness and opposition from the deplorables, so . . .

Not according to Drich, lol.  How could he have....soooo black.

(November 21, 2016 at 9:53 am)Drich Wrote:

(November 18, 2016 at 9:28 pm)Stimbo Wrote: That's what we've been trying to tell you every time you pop out a bible quote.

So then is it any different when you pop out a meme or some other persons words?

No, it's pretty much the same thing. That's the point. If it's okay for you to wind up your magic book and pull out an ace, it's okay for someone else to drop a meme or similar quote. If their doing that is a sign of limited intellect or whatever, then the same goes for you.

So which is it, my fine feathered fiend?

(November 18, 2016 at 7:13 pm)Aristocatt Wrote: I mean you came here asking what BLM wants.  Now when given another perspective you just shake your head and say nope, I must be interpreting this correctly.

WTF are you talking about? Read the OP again... I asked point blank what is "African American culture?" And is there 1 sucessful example of this culture? is their an example that we can use in place of our own and find our self in a better world? I never asked what BLM wants.. I am not asking what BLM wants I am telling you what they want as it is outlined in their manifesto. Then I am showing that contrasted, with our current constitutional rights and freedoms.

Quote:You haven't brought up new information, you just keep repeating the same thing over and over.

because you keep asking the same questions over and over... what did you expect. You ask a question the answer is "X" you rephrase and ask it another way... Hey smart guy the answer is still going to be "X"!!!

Quote:  You haven't bothered to address new information as it comes to you.

Not true I have gone literally line by line answering each point you bring up, you just do not like the answers or do not know how to argue what I have said so you ask your little monded questions all over again. Basically what your saying here is I am not playing by the normal rules of 'progressive/you and racist/me' and you are having a hard time outright calling me a racist with some foolish summary statement... Or is this what this post is supposed to be

Quote: Basically your argument boils down to:
I interpret statement X as anti democratic, therefore it must be anti democratic, therefore everything they say is anti Democratic.  

Again no. Statement "X" is indeed anti democratic as it "DEMANDS" a permanent "Black Power Base In Government" No matter how the electorate votes.

What don't you understand about that statement? IF/When you get that bit, Now follow up with the promise to "remake the current system of democracy to always include this black power base."

That my friend is not democratic, that is authoritarian rule. To demand "X" no matter what people vote has nothing to do with democracy.

Quote:You haven't explained why the statement you keep quoting is anti-democratic.  

I have said this several different times in several different ways... If you need me to further connect the dots you should just say I don't understand what you mean, can you make it simpler to understand.

Then I would tell you we are currently a democracy, as we elect our leadership. and then I would point out we have not elected the "Black power Base" BLM has "demanded"

So then if BLM is given what they want...

1.Black autonomy (Meaning Black are not subject to the laws the rest of the country are subjected to) See how they want to end the war on black people for details on this)

2.Black Rule (Meaning only blacks can govern black people) See the community control section of the manifesto for details on this

3.Black power base in the United States government (Black people still retain power over the rest of the country as it demands a political platform that is still strong enough to accept or reject government policy. (see political power)

4.'reparations' they want what amounts to a black socialist state (which has been voted down for all people)

5.They want power of the congressional purse to dictate when and where congress spends money.

6.a redistribution of wealth and assets. Meaning BLM want "Ownership of their communities.." (So did the southern states when they succeeded) My question here is who decides what is, and is not a black community? IS Say Detroit or Chicago a black community? is the house your living in an asset of the black community? Without an intact government to say no, or a united community to enforce that government's ruling, then any of this is up for grabs...

None of the above is new. It all been considered and shot down by democratic vote. Therefore to push these manifesto items into being, and legislation concerning any of the above, or anything that comes out from the above form of government that does not get a majority vote would be an example of Authoritarian or at the very least oligarchic rule.

As our current Democratic system does not/has not supported any of the said mandates with a majority vote.

Can you see how the enforcement of the manifesto is no longer apart of a democracy now?

Quote:They want more political power to be held by black people.  That is what the statement you keep repeating boils down to.

No The want more political power held by black people no matter how the electorate votes.
That is the anti democratic part, as the current system is a true reflection of what a democratic society looks like with a 20% representation of descendants of S-SAs descendants in the United states. A push for more political power is to push beyond what the democratic process has voted for.

Quote:They argue the current amount of power held by black people under represents the black community, and if voting were more democratic and less oligarchic, then that would be the case.  

No. you did not read or understand what the website's demands are. You are reading the propaganda part and not the manifesto mission statements. BLM wants independence for black people, and a political stake in what the rest of the country does as well.

Quote:That is a real point they are making.  And when you contextualize their demand for more power, their statement very clearly becomes anti-oligarchic.  

Again I AM LITERALLY QUOTING WORD FOR WORD THEIR DEMANDS!!! I am not putting ANY SPIN on what they are saying. I am not the one adding a narrative, You are the one guilty of deleting what the mission statement is clearly saying, in order to assimilate this message and make it moderate/about rights.

We demand independent Black political power and Black self-determination in all areas of society. We envision a remaking of the current U.S. political system in order to create a real democracy where Black people and all marginalized people can effectively exercise full political power.
(Bolding theirs not mine)

Quote:If you are unwilling to contextualize what they say, and take everything they say at absolute face value, then the most direct quote they have involves "creating a more perfect democracy".  

Hey moron in order for you to contextualize their stated objectives you must look at them through the lens of the mission header or the mission statement. All of the 'contextualization' MUST Happen though the lens or the frame work provided by the mission statement. Read it all again

We demand independent Black political power and Black self-determination in all areas of society. We envision a remaking of the current U.S. political system in order to create a real democracy where Black people and all marginalized people can effectively exercise full political power.

(Now this next bit is extremely important to understand. it's the bit you keep missing, and what makes this whole thing about the mission statement and not just the following 'contextualization.')

"This includes:"

Do you get it? no of course you don't.

"This includes" means the following is what we are going to use (BUT ARE NOT LIMITED TO) to start to achieve our stated goal... What is the stated goal?

We demand independent Black political power and Black self-determination in all areas of society. We envision a remaking of the current U.S. political system in order to create a real democracy where Black people and all marginalized people can effectively exercise full political power.

And this is how we are going to appeal to moderate morons who will look at the following and bit hook line and sinker by ignoring the mission statement and 'contextualize' it out of their tiny little minds as all of the following seems very reasonable...

Now let me ask you sport, what happens when all of that BS (the contextualized bit" fails? Does the Mission statement:
We demand independent Black political power and Black self-determination in all areas of society. We envision a remaking of the current U.S. political system in order to create a real democracy where Black people and all marginalized people can effectively exercise full political power.

Change in any way shape or form?

Do you get what I am asking? Let's say the gub-ment lets BLM have all the things they are asking in the 'contextualized part.' and it does not yield a black political power base and black determination that they want, do their efforts end there? or is the end goal A black power base and Black determination?

See you argument fails, because you assume that the 'contextualized bit' is what is being asked for/the end game for BLM. It's not. The 'contextualized bit' is eye candy for pre programed moderate drones. It is meant to appeal to 'educated people' as it uses all the proper key words and phrases to appeal to someone who has been trained to seek out words like equality, freedom, real democracy ect and like it/approve..

But again, the mission statement dictates then end game not the proposal. The proposal is meant to be a middle ground something that the other side can be enticed with, to help them swallow the bitter pill that will follow. That pill is:
We demand independent Black political power and Black self-determination in all areas of society. We envision a remaking of the current U.S. political system in order to create a real democracy where Black people and all marginalized people can effectively exercise full political power.

That bitter pill is bitter because again in our current democratic system we 'elected' not to elect the black power base and all the self determination they want. yet this is what they want and are pushing for.

Quote:That is part of their "rudder" that you wanted to put into context.  Now that you are being asked to contextualize a statement you seem to think(it doesn't even by itself) supports your argument by looking beyond simply one statement made, you push back and say "No I don't need to do that, I already have my answer".

Or, again you simply do not understand the points I was making, so you assumed I was being __________. What you failed to comprehend is that your 'contextualization' was a tool written into the manifesto to appeal to people like you, inorder for you to over look their stated goals for you very own narrative. You in your own 'contextualization' has justified and made a group of radicals who want to do away with the constitution, a 'moderate group.' because you refuse to look at their own words in a mission statement that DEMANDS A political power structure not consistent with our constitution, for your own narrative your own 'contextualization.'

Quote:But that's completely antithetical to why you came here.  
The only sensible question you asked in the OP was:
"Now my question is, what exactly is BLM trying to change?"

Also you don't know what confirmation bias is.

..and it seems you don't understand what rhetorical question is..

(November 21, 2016 at 10:18 am)Shell B Wrote: An African-American ran the United States for 8 years and did a pretty good job of it, in spite of his blackness and opposition from the deplorables, so . . .

Yeah, because we had more riots and racial division when bush was president. And we had a higher national debt, we had less than 4% GDP growth, inflation has not cut our buying power in 1/2, jobs are not leaving this country in droves, Violent crime is not out of control in our cities, and our military is not falling apart.. Not to even mention the terrorist attacks that are all but common place now. Oh, wait.. You mean this president is like by celebrities..
Never mind.

(November 21, 2016 at 2:22 pm)Stimbo Wrote:

(November 21, 2016 at 9:53 am)Drich Wrote: So then is it any different when you pop out a meme or some other persons words?

No, it's pretty much the same thing. That's the point. If it's okay for you to wind up your magic book and pull out an ace, it's okay for someone else to drop a meme or similar quote. If their doing that is a sign of limited intellect or whatever, then the same goes for you.

So which is it, my fine feathered fiend?

That's my point stims... I turned into and embraced the argument.

Now, All you got to do now is find an instance where I 'drop a bible quote' in an instance where one is not being asked for or the subject matter does not directly apply. You know kinda how you dropped a meme out of the blue.

Have you asked yourself why the military is falling apart?

(November 22, 2016 at 12:59 pm)Drich Wrote:

(November 21, 2016 at 2:22 pm)Stimbo Wrote: No, it's pretty much the same thing. That's the point. If it's okay for you to wind up your magic book and pull out an ace, it's okay for someone else to drop a meme or similar quote. If their doing that is a sign of limited intellect or whatever, then the same goes for you.

So which is it, my fine feathered fiend?

That's my point stims... I turned into and embraced the argument.

Now, All you got to do now is find an instance where I 'drop a bible quote' in an instance where one is not being asked for or the subject matter does not directly apply. You know kinda how you dropped a meme out of the blue.

Are you done?

Great. So which is it?