(January 23, 2017 at 4:27 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(January 23, 2017 at 4:26 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Which ultimately reduces to Might-Makes-Right. Not exactly what we would called liberal Western values.

Not at all. Enlightened self-interest can and does encourage humility and sacrifice as well.

Let's say you are right. How can you say that humility and sacrifice are good without appealing to the unproven notion that human life has value.

"Not enough evidence, Sir!" -Bertrand Russell

(January 23, 2017 at 3:53 pm)Mr Greene Wrote: Equality would be an aspiration rather than a principle.

For you maybe. Let's ask Genghis Khan how he feels about equality.

(January 23, 2017 at 3:53 pm)Mr Greene Wrote: Autonomy; my rights end when someone else's are infringed? Surely that one should be self explanatory.

The rights of the women he raped didn't seem to prevent 1 in 200 people from being descended from him. Sounds like his offspring did better than everyone elses', which is kinda how evolution works.

(January 23, 2017 at 4:33 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:

(January 23, 2017 at 3:57 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: Pointless suffering is bad. If you have an example where it isn't, I'd like to hear it.

In purely evolutionary terms, rape can sometimes be the only effective reproduction strategy for low-status males.* We're just 'dancing to our DNA**', don't ya'know.

*Robert Wright
**Richard Dawkins

Oh look an irrelevant post!

Social Darwinism does not follow logically from Darwinism.

It's no surprise to me that theists like you like to make non-sequiturs because if you weren't in the habit of making non-sequiturs you would be an atheist

(January 23, 2017 at 4:26 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:

(January 23, 2017 at 3:39 pm)Cephus Wrote: You have to remember that the core of all morality is enlightened self-interest.

Which ultimately reduces to Might-Makes-Right. Not exactly what we would called liberal Western values.

Just to clarify...atheists can act unselfishly, but they cannot justify calling that a good thing.

Sure they can because what is good or bad is entirely subjective and anyone can declare whatever they believe good.  You're pretending that your imaginary friend gives you the right to declare what you think is good to be universally good and you're wrong.

(January 23, 2017 at 4:44 pm)Alasdair Ham Wrote: Social Darwinism does not follow logically from Darwinism.

Tell that to Herbert Spencer, Thumpo, and your fellow atheists the next time they try to tell you that certain virtues promote group selection.

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(January 23, 2017 at 4:46 pm)Cephus Wrote: Sure they can because what is good or bad is entirely subjective...

Show me the evidence! Prove to me scientifically with a falsifiable method that what you are saying is true! You must believe in the tooth fairy.

(January 23, 2017 at 4:48 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:

(January 23, 2017 at 4:44 pm)Alasdair Ham Wrote: Social Darwinism does not follow logically from Darwinism.

Tell that to Herbert Spencer, Thumpo, and your fellow atheists the next time they try to tell you that certain virtues promote group selection.

(January 23, 2017 at 4:37 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:

(January 23, 2017 at 4:27 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Not at all. Enlightened self-interest can and does encourage humility and sacrifice as well.

Let's say you are right. How can you say that humility and sacrifice are good without appealing to the unproven notion that human life has value.

"Not enough evidence, Sir!" -Bertrand Russell

Given that the claim is regarding an abstraction -- values -- rather than the concrete -- asking for evidence of it seems unreasonably obtuse; and we haven't even broached the notion that values are subjective.

(January 23, 2017 at 4:48 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:

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(January 23, 2017 at 4:46 pm)Cephus Wrote: Sure they can because what is good or bad is entirely subjective...

Show me the evidence! Prove to me scientifically with a falsifiable method that what you are saying is true! You must believe in the tooth fairy.

You really are an idiot, aren't you?

(January 23, 2017 at 4:48 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Tell that to Herbert Spencer, Thumpo, and your fellow atheists the next time they try to tell you that certain virtues promote group selection.

My "fellow atheists"...



Yeah you're not worth it. But thanks for being irrelevant again.

(January 23, 2017 at 4:48 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Tell that to Herbert Spencer, Thumpo, and your fellow atheists the next time they try to tell you that certain virtues promote group selection.

Could you be so kind as to quote the post which gave you the impression I disagree with Hams?

(January 23, 2017 at 4:52 pm)Cephus Wrote:

(January 23, 2017 at 4:48 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:

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Show me the evidence! Prove to me scientifically with a falsifiable method that what you are saying is true! You must believe in the tooth fairy.

You really are an idiot, aren't you?

Only 50% of the time.

The other 50% he's disingenuous or intentionally obtuse

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(January 23, 2017 at 4:53 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(January 23, 2017 at 4:48 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Tell that to Herbert Spencer, Thumpo, and your fellow atheists the next time they try to tell you that certain virtues promote group selection.

Could you be so kind as to quote the post which gave you the impression I disagree with Hams?

Wait, Thumpo= Thump?

So he can't even spell now. Your name doesn't even contain an "o"

And who the fuck is Herbet Spencer?

That's probably how he spells my name