First, thanks to you all for offering your advice and some reassurance that I'm not crazy. Well, at least I think i'm not. lol I don't carry this on my shoulders every day, it's not something that is in the forefront of my mind every day. But, it's been creeping back in here and there, and I don't want to rug sweep it anymore, because I want to be authentic with my thoughts and emotions. I want them to 'agree.' I will come back later to reply to your posts, have to run some errands right now.

(July 9, 2017 at 11:55 am)Aliza Wrote: The belief system I think you're describing is basically just something you've welcomed into your life to make you happy. It doesn't sound like you're trying to convince other people to join you in your spiritual quest, and if it's not detrimental to your social and emotional well-being, then you should think the way you want. 

If you feel you have a need to believe in something because it brings you comfort, then you should take the necessary steps to secure your peace and happiness. Maybe feeling that there's some higher power just makes you feel more secure. This is your life, and you should live it your way. 

You owe no explanations to anyone, and if anyone argues with you over the privately held thoughts that you have in your head (that are there to bring you comfort and peace, not them), or if they try to pick them apart to debunk your way of thinking, or if they have trouble respecting you for not thinking exactly like them, then trust me on this one thing: Those people are maladjusted fucks, and should be ignored.

You do you.

I know you guys don't recruit or anything but maybe you can put in a good word to the grand jewish pope guy on Deidre's behalf.  Your faith seems compact and easy to carry, a benefit to you without being a burden to others.  She might like that.  (Would she have to that horrible looking gefithy fish?)

My sense of spirituality is simply a sense of being connected to something unimaginably larger than myself -- the Universe. It requires no faith on my part to feel that humility, and no woo for me to find comfort in it.

(July 9, 2017 at 1:24 pm)Whateverist Wrote:

(July 9, 2017 at 11:55 am)Aliza Wrote: The belief system I think you're describing is basically just something you've welcomed into your life to make you happy. It doesn't sound like you're trying to convince other people to join you in your spiritual quest, and if it's not detrimental to your social and emotional well-being, then you should think the way you want. 

If you feel you have a need to believe in something because it brings you comfort, then you should take the necessary steps to secure your peace and happiness. Maybe feeling that there's some higher power just makes you feel more secure. This is your life, and you should live it your way. 

You owe no explanations to anyone, and if anyone argues with you over the privately held thoughts that you have in your head (that are there to bring you comfort and peace, not them), or if they try to pick them apart to debunk your way of thinking, or if they have trouble respecting you for not thinking exactly like them, then trust me on this one thing: Those people are maladjusted fucks, and should be ignored.

You do you.

I know you guys don't recruit or anything but maybe you can put in a good word to the grand jewish pope guy on Deidre's behalf.  Your faith seems compact and easy to carry, a benefit to you without being a burden to others.  She might like that.  (Would she have to that horrible looking gefithy fish?)

GEFILTE FISH IS AWESOME! Especially with some horse raddish.
 
Jews don't have a pope-like counterpart because each Jew is equal and no Jew has authority over any other Jew. If we attach ourselves to the teachings of a particular Rabbi, that Rabbi carries no real authority over anyone. He (or she) may make suggestions, but people choose on their own whether to follow them or not. Leading the entire Jewish people is a lot like herding cats anyway.
 
Actually, we do have a counterpart faith for gentiles that Deidre might find is a good fit. The nice thing about Noahidism is that you can be as involved or not involved as you like. It's really more of a way of living than it is an organized movement, though some ex-Christians who find themselves in Noahidism may organize with weekly meetings or do services like a synagogue.
 
Basically, all Noahidism is living a respectful life that promotes good will toward others. Belief in G-d is optional, but usually people who are attracted to Noahidism do want to believe in G-d, they just don't want to be bogged down with all the religious bullshit. The Noahide laws are as follows, which I'm adding commentary to to explain my understanding of the law.
 
1) Do not murder. (Killing and murdering are different in Judaism. There’s something about the Hebrew word for murder that implies the blood rushing to the head (I forget the details here), so just to cover our bases, we include deliberately embarrassing others because embarrassing them causes them to blush. It’s a good policy either way.)

2) Do not steal. (Stealing may be expanded to include dishonest business transactions, or even being a total dickhead and refusing to tip the waiter when the culture dictates that tipping is how you compensate the waiter for services rendered.)

3) Do not worship false gods. (A better understanding of this may be “don’t commit human sacrifice to ensure a good crop,” or “don’t become so wrapped up in your screwy view of G-d that you cause harm to yourself or your community.” What people think they understand about G-d may be right or wrong, but worshiping may include some damaging behaviors.)

4) Do not be sexually immoral. (This ultimately translates to: Don’t commit adultery with someone else’s spouse. It’s douchey. Let that person leave their spouse fair and square before you sleep with them. Why? Because as fun as your affair may be, it hurts someone else. This does not necessarily include swinging and open marriages. From everything I understand about Judaism, the details would be flexible according to the tenor of society’s views on sex and what constitutes sexual immorality. It would be determined by the community at large.)

5) Do not eat the limb removed from a live animal. (Not a lot of room for interpretation here. Don’t chop an animal’s leg off and eat it. It causes the animal to suffer. This can also be generalized to treating animals with kindness and dignity. Kill the animal in a humane manner before you eat it.)  

6) Do not curse God. (This one would be very hard to do, as saying “G-d damn!” or “I think the Lord above is a cock sucking fucktard” doesn’t count as cursing. Cursing G-d requires a more specific set of actions, and thinking or feeling anger toward G-d isn't a part of those actions.)


7) Set up courts and bring offenders to justice. (If you live in a society with other people, you already follow this.)

(July 9, 2017 at 11:55 am)Aliza Wrote: The belief system I think you're describing is basically just something you've welcomed into your life to make you happy. It doesn't sound like you're trying to convince other people to join you in your spiritual quest, and if it's not detrimental to your social and emotional well-being, then you should think the way you want. 

If you feel you have a need to believe in something because it brings you comfort, then you should take the necessary steps to secure your peace and happiness. Maybe feeling that there's some higher power just makes you feel more secure. This is your life, and you should live it your way. 

You owe no explanations to anyone, and if anyone argues with you over the privately held thoughts that you have in your head (that are there to bring you comfort and peace, not them), or if they try to pick them apart to debunk your way of thinking, or if they have trouble respecting you for not thinking exactly like them, then trust me on this one thing: Those people are maladjusted fucks, and should be ignored.

You do you.

From a legal standpoint absolutely, but even then, if one is simply going to say, "I like it" or "I have the right", that still means nothing. Even when not trying to convince others, it is still important if one wants to know if they are correct in their position, to be willing to self examine it. By that I don't mean to fish for reasons to keep it, but to look for universal independent conformation beyond one's own bias. If one is unwilling to consider they got it wrong, then they are not being objective. 

Outside that, it should remain merely your opinion.

---

(July 9, 2017 at 2:09 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: My sense of spirituality is simply a sense of being connected to something unimaginably larger than myself -- the Universe. It requires no faith on my part to feel that humility, and no woo for me to find comfort in it.

I never use the word "spirituality", it is highly subjective and started in a very superstitious past.

I get the same feelings too. But that to me is merely my body having a positive reaction to stimuli. My "sense of awe" and yes, that can be intense.

But knowing that while the universe has some really awesome things in it, it also has lots of extremely destructive and deadly things in it too. I am extremely amazed with all the countless factors that could have ended up with a different result but didn't, that we are here. But I see no grand design in the universe and do not see it as a giant living thing. I simply see both the good and the bad in it as natural with no super cognition behind it. But certainly our planet and universe have some damned amazing things in it, certainly.

(July 9, 2017 at 2:09 pm)lol Thumpalumpacus Wrote: My sense of spirituality is simply a sense of being connected to something unimaginably larger than myself -- the Universe. It requires no faith on my part to feel that humility, and no woo for me to find comfort in it.

I wish I could give you 1000 kudos! I love this, it has the makings of a great religion. 

Oh wait



No seriously though, I think this is how I'm feeling and the need in me to call it god, well it's just a need in me based on habit.

(July 9, 2017 at 1:07 pm)*Deidre* Wrote: First, thanks to you all for offering your advice and some reassurance that I'm not crazy. Well, at least I think i'm not. lol I don't carry this on my shoulders every day, it's not something that is in the forefront of my mind every day. But, it's been creeping back in here and there, and I don't want to rug sweep it anymore, because I want to be authentic with my thoughts and emotions. I want them to 'agree.' I will come back later to reply to your posts, have to run some errands right now.

They may never agree..regardless of whether or not you count yourself among the believing.  I've never met a person, personally, in all of my life...and I've never seen a person on these boards....and I've never even heard of a -story- of a person who...by believing, brought accord between those two.  We believe, and still feel conflicted.  We do not believe, and still feel conflicted.  We -disbelieve-....and still feel conflicted.

(July 9, 2017 at 2:15 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(July 9, 2017 at 11:55 am)Aliza Wrote: The belief system I think you're describing is basically just something you've welcomed into your life to make you happy. It doesn't sound like you're trying to convince other people to join you in your spiritual quest, and if it's not detrimental to your social and emotional well-being, then you should think the way you want. 

If you feel you have a need to believe in something because it brings you comfort, then you should take the necessary steps to secure your peace and happiness. Maybe feeling that there's some higher power just makes you feel more secure. This is your life, and you should live it your way. 

You owe no explanations to anyone, and if anyone argues with you over the privately held thoughts that you have in your head (that are there to bring you comfort and peace, not them), or if they try to pick them apart to debunk your way of thinking, or if they have trouble respecting you for not thinking exactly like them, then trust me on this one thing: Those people are maladjusted fucks, and should be ignored.

You do you.

From a legal standpoint absolutely, but even then, if one is simply going to say, "I like it" or "I have the right", that still means nothing. Even when not trying to convince others, it is still important if one wants to know if they are correct in their position, to be willing to self examine it. By that I don't mean to fish for reasons to keep it, but to look for universal independent conformation beyond one's own bias. If one is unwilling to consider they got it wrong, then they are not being objective. 

Outside that, it should remain merely your opinion.

Why do they need to be right? Maybe they're not interested in being right because their focus is on living a happy life. Being right about religion doesn't happen to change how much joy their children bring them, how much beauty they find in watching the sunset, or how awesome their trip to Thailand was.

(July 9, 2017 at 2:22 pm)*Deidre* Wrote:

(July 9, 2017 at 2:09 pm)lol Thumpalumpacus Wrote: My sense of spirituality is simply a sense of being connected to something unimaginably larger than myself -- the Universe. It requires no faith on my part to feel that humility, and no woo for me to find comfort in it.

I wish I could give you 1000 kudos! I love this, it has the makings of a great religion. 

Oh wait



No seriously though, I think this is how I'm feeling and the need in me to call it god, well it's just a need in me based on habit.

I put my feelings about what I observe in life and nature and the universe as being a really intense sense of awe, but not magical, just intense. Again, our planet and universe also have some pretty nasty things in it too. That does not negate fore me any of the good. I find it amazing that everything is made of atoms, and that with all the countless things that could have lead to different outcomes, but didn't, I find that amazing. Extremely amazing, but not magical and not "spiritual". 

Bacteria, and cancer and crime and war and natural disasters are also part of our existence. One pulsar or exploding sun too close to us, and bye bye. Our planet has had 5 mass extinctions, and no matter what, our species will be long gone in 5 billion years when our sun runs out of fuel in any case.

But sure, ask me about the love of my mom, or the love of my cat, or a pretty ocean view or sunset. Hell yea that is awesome to think about too. I simply don't assign any of this to old words, woo or mythology.

(July 9, 2017 at 2:27 pm)Khemikal Wrote:

(July 9, 2017 at 1:07 pm)*Deidre* Wrote: First, thanks to you all for offering your advice and some reassurance that I'm not crazy. Well, at least I think i'm not. lol I don't carry this on my shoulders every day, it's not something that is in the forefront of my mind every day. But, it's been creeping back in here and there, and I don't want to rug sweep it anymore, because I want to be authentic with my thoughts and emotions. I want them to 'agree.' I will come back later to reply to your posts, have to run some errands right now.

They may never agree..regardless of whether or not you count yourself among the believing.  I've never met a person, personally, in all of my life...and I've never seen a person on these boards....and I've never even heard of a -story- of a person who...by believing, brought accord between those two.  We believe, and still feel conflicted.  We do not believe, and still feel conflicted.  We -disbelieve-....and still feel conflicted.

This. You have no idea how this ^^^ has helped me. You disbelieve, yet also at times, are conflicted. My atheist friends offline don't share their conflicts, so I assume that they have none with their position. But, while I'm not happy that you and others experience this, I'm grateful that this might just be a human thing, and I'm not all that out there for feeling this.