Posts: 23006
Threads: 26
Joined: February 2, 2010
Reputation:
106
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:16 am
(August 29, 2017 at 10:01 am)Astonished Wrote: (August 29, 2017 at 9:59 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: No, it isn't. What they've seen is the event itself. Evidence is that information which would bring a third person to a conclusion about what had happened in the event, even though the third person wasn't there.
What they've seen and what they believe happened and how they recall it happening in their mind, are three entirely different things.
Of course. That's the point of this discussion, when you boil it down.
Posts: 2013
Threads: 28
Joined: January 1, 2017
Reputation:
15
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:17 am
(August 29, 2017 at 10:16 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: (August 29, 2017 at 10:01 am)Astonished Wrote: What they've seen and what they believe happened and how they recall it happening in their mind, are three entirely different things.
Of course. That's the point of this discussion, when you boil it down.
So why can't that sink into any of the minds of any of the proponents of testimony?
Religions were invented to impress and dupe illiterate, superstitious stone-age peasants. So in this modern, enlightened age of information, what's your excuse? Or are you saying with all your advantages, you were still tricked as easily as those early humans?
---
There is no better way to convey the least amount of information in the greatest amount of words than to try explaining your religious views.
Posts: 3709
Threads: 18
Joined: September 29, 2015
Reputation:
10
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:19 am
(August 29, 2017 at 9:59 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: (August 29, 2017 at 8:49 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: [...] The evidence is what they had seen [...]
No, it isn't. What they've seen is the event itself. Evidence is that information which would bring a third person to a conclusion about what had happened in the event, even though the third person wasn't there.
What they seen of the event, is not information in which to base a conclusion? Does a person need to see the evidence for themselves, in order for it to be evidence?
It is said that an argument is what convinces reasonable men and a proof is what it takes to convince even an unreasonable man. - Alexander Vilenkin
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther
Posts: 23006
Threads: 26
Joined: February 2, 2010
Reputation:
106
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:22 am
(August 29, 2017 at 10:17 am)Astonished Wrote: (August 29, 2017 at 10:16 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Of course. That's the point of this discussion, when you boil it down.
So why can't that sink into any of the minds of any of the proponents of testimony?
![[Image: db2beb1615d907748637770057da1b88.gif]](https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/db/2b/eb/db2beb1615d907748637770057da1b88.gif)
Posts: 2013
Threads: 28
Joined: January 1, 2017
Reputation:
15
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:22 am
(August 29, 2017 at 10:19 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: (August 29, 2017 at 9:59 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: No, it isn't. What they've seen is the event itself. Evidence is that information which would bring a third person to a conclusion about what had happened in the event, even though the third person wasn't there.
What they seen of the event, is not information in which to base a conclusion? Does a person need to see the evidence for themselves, in order for it to be evidence?
How do you manage to ignore every relevant point? How? HOW?!!!!!!!
Religions were invented to impress and dupe illiterate, superstitious stone-age peasants. So in this modern, enlightened age of information, what's your excuse? Or are you saying with all your advantages, you were still tricked as easily as those early humans?
---
There is no better way to convey the least amount of information in the greatest amount of words than to try explaining your religious views.
Posts: 23006
Threads: 26
Joined: February 2, 2010
Reputation:
106
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:27 am
(August 29, 2017 at 10:19 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: What they seen of the event, is not information in which to base a conclusion? Does a person need to see the evidence for themselves, in order for it to be evidence?
You missed my point. The event is not the evidence. The event is the occurrence. If you're going to engage in discussion, it pays to use words in accordance with their definitions.
As for your second question, I've already mentioned in this thread that I think testimony may be evidence in some situations. If a person comes to a conclusion in the absence of evidence -- such as you or NS with regards to your faith -- that's your business. If you want to convince me of something, bring me evidence.
Posts: 11697
Threads: 117
Joined: November 5, 2016
Reputation:
43
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:31 am
(This post was last modified: August 29, 2017 at 10:32 am by Amarok.)
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
Inuit Proverb
Posts: 9915
Threads: 53
Joined: November 27, 2015
Reputation:
92
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 10:56 am
(This post was last modified: August 29, 2017 at 10:58 am by LadyForCamus.)
(August 29, 2017 at 10:22 am)Astonished Wrote: (August 29, 2017 at 10:19 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: What they seen of the event, is not information in which to base a conclusion? Does a person need to see the evidence for themselves, in order for it to be evidence?
How do you manage to ignore every relevant point? How? HOW?!!!!!!!
practice.
He will take us down this inane rabbit hole for as long as we're willing to go along.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”
Wiser words were never spoken.
Posts: 2013
Threads: 28
Joined: January 1, 2017
Reputation:
15
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 11:01 am
Religions were invented to impress and dupe illiterate, superstitious stone-age peasants. So in this modern, enlightened age of information, what's your excuse? Or are you saying with all your advantages, you were still tricked as easily as those early humans?
---
There is no better way to convey the least amount of information in the greatest amount of words than to try explaining your religious views.
Posts: 11697
Threads: 117
Joined: November 5, 2016
Reputation:
43
RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 29, 2017 at 11:08 am
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
Inuit Proverb
|
![[Image: banging-head-on-desk.gif]](https://atheistforums.org/images/smilies/banging-head-on-desk.gif)
