(September 26, 2017 at 11:06 am)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: What it all comes down to here is looking deep into the research and debates to draw your own conclusion.  I have done so and, personally, I just can't decide one way or the other.  If there is a conclusion to be reached there one way or the other, then it has not made itself obvious to me in any sense of the word.  There are just so much highly intelligent arguments and research being put forth that there is not only any way for me to decide one way or the other, but there is no way I can even begin to comprehend and understand some of the technical information being put forth in their research/debates.

I hope that you never run into a cult that has less than honorable intentions, you'd be easy pickins. Maybe church/religion is the best place for you. Most are reasonably safe. And their delusions are still accepted by a majority of our society.

(September 26, 2017 at 12:00 pm)mh.brewer Wrote:

(September 26, 2017 at 11:06 am)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: What it all comes down to here is looking deep into the research and debates to draw your own conclusion.  I have done so and, personally, I just can't decide one way or the other.  If there is a conclusion to be reached there one way or the other, then it has not made itself obvious to me in any sense of the word.  There are just so much highly intelligent arguments and research being put forth that there is not only any way for me to decide one way or the other, but there is no way I can even begin to comprehend and understand some of the technical information being put forth in their research/debates.

I hope that you never run into a cult that has less than honorable intentions, you'd be easy pickins. Maybe church/religion is the best place for you. Most are reasonably safe. And their delusions are still accepted by a majority of our society.

I don't fall for any delusion.  Rather, I just keep an open mind on things.

(September 26, 2017 at 12:02 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: I don't fall for any delusion.  Rather, I just keep an open mind on things.

Your posts here indicate that you have.

(September 26, 2017 at 12:03 pm)mh.brewer Wrote:

(September 26, 2017 at 12:02 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: I don't fall for any delusion.  Rather, I just keep an open mind on things.

Your posts here indicate that you have.

When I said things such as that it is a known fact that emotions are the only things that can make things matter to us, then I was just saying that.  I was just going by what that highly intelligent skeptic/neuroscientist said in my whole discussion with him in that very long post I presented to you earlier.

(September 26, 2017 at 10:59 am)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: I am still open minded regardless of what you say here because how would one of the nde/paranormal researchers respond to this post of yours?  I am quite sure they would have their own valid objections to this based upon their years of expertise.  So, can you see where I am going with this?  It is still nothing more than a back and forth argument that leads nowhere because it doesn't matter what arguments you or the proponents make; it will still be nothing more than an ongoing debate.

What I see in many of your posts is the fallacy of false equivalence. These paranormal researchers you speak of, who are they and what are their qualifications in the field? The term 'paranormal researcher' is not a protected term, anyone can call themselves a PR. In order to become an authority on the paranormal wouldn't it be prudent to first establish that the phenomena exists? No one in the history of the world has ever demonstrated any aspect of the paranormal. No one! So how is it possible for these characters to have years of expertise in the paranormal?

So when we have an exchange between scientists and proponents of the paranormal it is most definitely not a case of; 'the truth must lie halfway in the middle' there is no 'middle'. The null hypothesis is: there is no such thing as the paranormal. It's quite easy to overturn the null hypothesis, demonstrate ouija boards actually work.

You repeatedly state how open minded you are, is there anything you reject without a second thought, anything at all? Or are you prepared to consider any, and every, insane proposition put to you by cranks, nutters and charlatans?

(September 26, 2017 at 12:26 pm)Succubus Wrote:

(September 26, 2017 at 10:59 am)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: I am still open minded regardless of what you say here because how would one of the nde/paranormal researchers respond to this post of yours?  I am quite sure they would have their own valid objections to this based upon their years of expertise.  So, can you see where I am going with this?  It is still nothing more than a back and forth argument that leads nowhere because it doesn't matter what arguments you or the proponents make; it will still be nothing more than an ongoing debate.

What I see in many of your posts is the fallacy of false equivalence. These paranormal researchers you speak of, who are they and what are their qualifications in the field? The term 'paranormal researcher' is not a protected term, anyone can call themselves a PR. In order to become an authority on the paranormal wouldn't it be prudent to first establish that the phenomena exists? No one in the history of the world has ever demonstrated any aspect of the paranormal. No one! So how is it possible for these characters to have years of expertise in the paranormal?

So when we have an exchange between scientists and proponents of the paranormal it is most definitely not a case of; 'the truth must lie halfway in the middle' there is no 'middle'. The null hypothesis is: there is no such thing as the paranormal. It's quite easy to overturn the null hypothesis, demonstrate ouija boards actually work.

You repeatedly state how open minded you are, is there anything you reject without a second thought, anything at all? Or are you prepared to consider any, and every, insane proposition put to you by cranks, nutters and charlatans?

Actually, I would like to get back on topic now since this is the topic I wish to really discuss.  I will point out that long post I made earlier which was a discussion between me and another highly intelligent skeptic:

https://atheistforums.org/thread-51313-p...pid1625672

That 'discussion' is nothing more than a story you've posted on an internet forum.

(September 26, 2017 at 1:10 pm)Succubus Wrote: That 'discussion' is nothing more than a story you've posted on an internet forum.

It's not a story.  It is a real discussion:

http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.ph...97#p605797

The fact that we might and yet to be discovered are in the title of the thread lends total rational credence to the subject being discussed.

(September 26, 2017 at 1:01 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: Actually, I would like to get back on topic now since this is the topic I wish to really discuss.  I will point out that long post I made earlier which was a discussion between me and another highly intelligent skeptic:

https://atheistforums.org/thread-51313-p...pid1625672

What exactly makes you think that the individual that agreed with you is "highly intelligent"? What is his/her degree in neuroscience in? Where did he graduate from?

I find that quite a bit of what this person says is questionable.