(April 4, 2018 at 12:13 pm)mlmooney89 Wrote:

(April 4, 2018 at 12:08 pm)pocaracas Wrote: Suppose people don't tip them, so they don't make a shit ton in tips?
Would you get their support then?

Then they whine that they make their living like that and we are taking food from their mouths. It's like you can't help those that don't want to be helped. It's just annoying that they don't want to be helped but then bitch about it. I'm in a spat with a bar tender right now over this. She is actually pushing for people to share a post that says don't tip your waiter "gift" them money so they don't have to claim it on taxes.

(April 5, 2018 at 9:29 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(April 5, 2018 at 8:31 am)Joods Wrote: Being in the service industry,  please allow me to explain some reasons why they may do that.  

1. Federal wages for servers is a whopping  $2.83 an hour and it's been that way for at least 20 years if not more. If it's  dead in the restaurant, you are losing money. Work a 40 hour week and your tips only add up to maybe $300 for the week and then see that your actual paycheck is about $30 after taxes, if that,  it can be very frustrating.  That's not a livable wage and many who work in the service related industry barely make enough to get by.  
2. Many customers now leave a tip on their credit card statements. All of those tips get taxed, despite what customers believe. Why?  Because there is now a paper trail and the employer is required to report those tips.

3. Servers are only required to report a certain percentage of their tips. 10 percent is the minimum. If the bulk of my tips are placed on a credit card and all that is getting taxed,  you're damn straight that I'm not reporting anything I get in cash.  Especially of 80% of my tips are already being reported to the govt.  

4. A lot of customers don't even tip the proper amount of 15 - 18 %. The server I just had this morning told me she's been at the restaurant for 21 years and all her paychecks are voided because her hours just barely cover her insurance and she pays taxes based on her sales. So if she had $650 in food sales,  she's getting taxed on that plus any tips reported on a credit card, regardless of what her total rips plus hourly comes out to be.  So there's lots of variables and reasons for why people don't claim all their tips.  I wish people would consider that before getting mad or not tipping properly. I worked for three months at Smart Style and never got a cent of the commission I should have received simply because my service sales weren't high enough. I was busting ass with retail sales,  but they don't give you commission on retail unless you meet your service sales goals. That's really hard to do when you are new to the industry. And it's completely frustrating when your paycheck is only for minimum wage and you have kids to feed and student loans to repay and you feel like you busted your ass.

Shit.  Some people don't even bother to tip. I won't take those people again as clients. I have expenses to meet as well and I rely on my tips to help restock my supplies.

See the bit I bolded?
That's the only thing that needs to be fixed. Everything else then falls into place.
And, trust me, the employers will not go bankrupt and the customers will still pay the same (considering the present-day tip included in this fairer price)

If people want to discourage crappy service, simply don't return to where they get crappy service.
If they want to encourage it, return.
If it seems simple, it's because it is. And is basically what happens in many other places.

FYI, the whole $2.83 an hour is bullshit. That's the legal minimum employers have to pay service staff, and the rest is expected to be made up in tips. However, if the combined wages and tips earned in any week do not add up to $7.25 (standard minimum wage) then the employer must increase their wage to make up for the loss. Servers do not lose out on any money by not getting tips.

Also: "As of May 2017, the average hourly wage – including tips – for a restaurant employee in the United States that received tip income was $11.82."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wag...ted_States

Very well, then.
Give people a contract for an average of $11.00 per hour, and start discouraging tips, countrywide. Clearly, the consumer is affording it, as well as the employers.

But, as for the present day reality, how do the employers account for the tips to reach that minimum of $7.25, if they are not declared by the employees?

(April 5, 2018 at 12:11 pm)Tiberius Wrote: FYI, the whole $2.83 an hour is bullshit. That's the legal minimum employers have to pay service staff, and the rest is expected to be made up in tips. However, if the combined wages and tips earned in any week do not add up to $7.25 (standard minimum wage) then the employer must increase their wage to make up for the loss. Servers do not lose out on any money by not getting tips.

Also: "As of May 2017, the average hourly wage – including tips – for a restaurant employee in the United States that received tip income was $11.82."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wag...ted_States

The only thing that ever made me be able to put up with the bullshit of working a busy night in food and beverage was knowing that there would be bank at the end of it. Sure, on slow days, you don't get squat. But you don't do squat either.

Wait, people actually tip waiters/waitresses at restaurants? I've never tipped one in my life!

And here's me complimenting the chef and donating to the restaurant!

I think the waiter/waitress would be the last person I tip, lol. I'd be tipping the chef first for cooking such awesome food. Or even the barista for making such a perfect cocktail. Can't be difficult to take someone's order down on a piece of paper, smile at them and walk away. (OH WOW BUT THEY HAVE TO REMEMBER THE TABLE NUMBER TOO! OH GOSH! THE HORROR!)

Yeah I get that chefs and baristas already have higher wages... but it's for a reason I think... I don't think waiters/waitresses need to be making a fortune on tips when I can't think of a job less difficult than theirs. If their wage is too small it should just be increased. I doubt it's too small. Maybe it's too large considering they make so much on tips already, when the money should really be going to the person who cooked your meal if it's nice enough to keep coming back (especially when there are so many restaurants with such disappointing food).

Rant over

(April 4, 2018 at 12:56 pm)Hammy Wrote:

(April 4, 2018 at 7:29 am)Little lunch Wrote: Hang on, this guy is an extremely smart man. I have felt like punching his head in a few times, but I have also found a few real gems.
One thing he said was this - that you should listen to people with an expectation that they might know something that you don't, especially those you disagree with as they may be able to shine a light in your blind spot.
Give the book a read, you're smart enough to not get sucked into ideologies you disagree with and you might learn something you didn't know.

Incidently, I feel exactly the same way about Ben Shapiro.

My guess is that anything "smart" that comes out of his mouth is an idea he has stolen from somebody else.

When you see him have a conversation with someone who actually is smart, he quickly shows himself to be a complete moron.

Or maybe I just have high standards

I've seen his talk with Sam Harris and he comes across as a real dick.
But if you think he's a complete moron then it's obvious you've not really looked into him at all.