Apparently, he explained himself: "It was somewhere between a caress and a slap, I hoped to calm him down, I didn’t know what to do." This excuse might have been understandable if this was a younger priest, but he's 89. I don't know how long he's been active in the priesthood, but this can't be the first time he's had to deal with a baby crying during baptism. He is clearly trying to bullshit his way out of trouble.

(June 23, 2018 at 8:29 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Apparently, he explained himself: "It was somewhere between a caress and a slap, I hoped to calm him down, I didn’t know what to do." This excuse might have been understandable if this was a younger priest, but he's 89. I don't know how long he's been active in the priesthood, but this can't be the first time he's had to deal with a baby crying during baptism. He is clearly trying to bullshit his way out of trouble.

There is also no way to classify that as anything even close to a "caress".

The slap was to exorcise the demon of crying out of the baby. Obviously.

(June 23, 2018 at 5:23 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: It’s so awful. The baby was clearly already terrified of what was going on. And his own mother makes no move to take him, or comfort him. It makes me feel sick.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree on this point. One crucial thing to know about babies: they cry. A lot. They cry when they're hungry, they cry when they've crapped themselves, they cry for no reason whatsoever. It's a big reason (besides my own mental issues and my anti-natalist philosophy) I've decided to never become a parent. It's impossible to judge from the video what kind of cry it is (at least until the priest slaps him), but it doesn't look like any water has touched the kid's head at any point in the video. And, as far as I can tell, he's probably not even old enough to understand language yet (when I was baptized, as a Lutheran, I was only two months old). There is no reason to believe anything specifically related to the scenario (besides maybe not being where he expected to be) is stressing him out at this point. If we saw the priest dunk him in the baptismal font or pouring water on his head, or even if it seemed sinister that he's making the sign of the cross on the baby with holy water, that idea would work, but nothing has happened until the slap.

(June 23, 2018 at 8:29 pm)chimp3 Wrote: The nature of the believer/ clergy relationship is one of subservience. The fact that the parents did not punch the priest out is evidence of that!

That was exactly my first thought.  Only religion could make a parent hesitate to react when someone slaps their baby in the face.

(June 23, 2018 at 8:44 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote:

(June 23, 2018 at 8:29 pm)chimp3 Wrote: The nature of the believer/ clergy relationship is one of subservience. The fact that the parents did not punch the priest out is evidence of that!

That was exactly my first thought.  Only religion could make a parent hesitate to react when someone slaps their baby in the face.

I strongly suspect that maybe other professions of authority might cause such non-reaction, although religion is clearly the one most suitable to such a non-reaction. Either that or the mother really gives that little of a shit.

(June 23, 2018 at 8:42 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote:

(June 23, 2018 at 5:23 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: It’s so awful.  The baby was clearly already terrified of what was going on.  And his own mother makes no move to take him, or comfort him.  It makes me feel sick.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree on this point. One crucial thing to know about babies: they cry. A lot. They cry when they're hungry, they cry when they've crapped themselves, they cry for no reason whatsoever. It's a big reason (besides my own mental issues and my anti-natalist philosophy) I've decided to never become a parent. It's impossible to judge from the video what kind of cry it is (at least until the priest slaps him), but it doesn't look like any water has touched the kid's head at any point in the video. And, as far as I can tell, he's probably not even old enough to understand language yet (when I was baptized, as a Lutheran, I was only two months old). There is no reason to believe anything specifically related to the scenario (besides maybe not being where he expected to be) is stressing him out at this point. If we saw the priest dunk him in the baptismal font or pouring water on his head, or even if it seemed sinister that he's making the sign of the cross on the baby with holy water, that idea would work, but nothing has happened until the slap.

I don’t think I expressed my thoughts clearly.  I wasn’t implying that the baptism itself was some kind of wrongful, traumatic antecedent.  I don’t think that.  If that were the case you’d have to argue similarly that everything nurses have to do to newborns after delivery is equally as harmful.  To me it seemed like he was crying because he was scared (and I certainly could be wrong as I was wrong often with my own two little ones 😛), but I’m not saying that means the baptism ritual is abusive in its own right.  My point was more to the fact that a baby, who was already distraught and crying, got a slap to his face instead of comforting arms.  That is what’s so heartbreaking to me.

My one concern with the scenario is that the priest is obviously an older man. Many factors could have been involved, and something tells me that it was more involuntary than voluntary.

(June 23, 2018 at 8:31 pm)Mr.wizard Wrote:

(June 23, 2018 at 8:29 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Apparently, he explained himself: "It was somewhere between a caress and a slap, I hoped to calm him down, I didn’t know what to do." This excuse might have been understandable if this was a younger priest, but he's 89. I don't know how long he's been active in the priesthood, but this can't be the first time he's had to deal with a baby crying during baptism. He is clearly trying to bullshit his way out of trouble.

There is also no way to classify that as anything even close to a "caress".

And I hope that where they're from, "caress" has a less sexual connotation, so he's not digging himself deeper. Then again, it seems his superior is the bishop of Meaux, which is close to Paris, I doubt it.

(June 23, 2018 at 8:29 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Apparently, he explained himself: "It was somewhere between a caress and a slap, I hoped to calm him down, I didn’t know what to do." This excuse might have been understandable if this was a younger priest, but he's 89. I don't know how long he's been active in the priesthood, but this can't be the first time he's had to deal with a baby crying during baptism. He is clearly trying to bullshit his way out of trouble.

Boy, that was the most violent caress I’ve ever seen! 🤔