The Quran is a big book.

Usually; the reader might question its context and its main goal, just like any other book.
These two questions are the most common, and the reason a reader reads the book from A to Z.

People use the "Chronological Order" to understand the context and the main goal even more; but the Quran doesn't follow a chronological order in terms of chapters.
Yes; that is the first fact about the book.

EG: if you read page 1, then jump to page 500, there's nothing telling you which chapter was revealed to prophet Mohammed -peace be upon him- from God first.

Muslim scholars intervened to categorize the chapters of the Quran without altering the content of the book itself; they left the Quran as it is, but wrote down dates that the chapters were revealed in. You can find the list here:

https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Chronological...e_Qur%27an

Of course, this chronological order -as it is the case with all Islamic literature aside from the Quran- is no more than an attempt from the Muslim scholars.
Prophet Mohammed peace be upon him didn't write this -or order to write it-. He only ordered the Quran itself to be written.

Personally; I think and believe that the Quran must remain like it was revealed. If the prophet didn't order for the chronological order to be followed; then it shouldn't be followed.

The Sunni and Shiite sects use the chronological order stated in the Hadith books -like the order in the link I posted above-. This gives a lot of flexibility to play with the meanings, twist left and right to make a false point true.

Quote:He only ordered the Quran itself to be written

And you know this because ...



C'mon man. You're pretty cluey on most things except this huge arse elephant in the room.

(November 18, 2018 at 2:41 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: The Sunni and Shiite sects use the chronological order stated in the Hadith books -like the order in the link I posted above-. This gives a lot of flexibility to play with the meanings, twist left and right to make a false point true.

Interesting hypothesis. Here's mine: people will find ways for holy books to mean whatever alligns with their own views no matter how they are read and, to an extent, no matter what's even written in them.

Just cuz it' s written, doesn't mean it' s true.


If the Quaran or Bible were written today, they wouldn't even sell at the supermarket check out Lane.....


It' d be self published, internet sales only.

(November 18, 2018 at 5:20 am)Mr.Obvious Wrote:

(November 18, 2018 at 2:41 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: The Sunni and Shiite sects use the chronological order stated in the Hadith books -like the order in the link I posted above-. This gives a lot of flexibility to play with the meanings, twist left and right to make a false point true.

Interesting hypothesis. Here's mine: people will find ways for holy books to mean whatever alligns with their own views no matter how they are read and, to an extent,  no matter what's even written in them.

Indeed from what I've seen of the koran the language is flowery and vague. 

Some people have found a book of love and peace in there.
Others have read the same book and read, lets kill everyone that isn't exactly the same as us and rape all the women folk.

You get out of it what you take to it.

I necer expected you to use "Wiki Islam". I try to avoid it myself. Though I admkt that I lost interst in examining the Quran many months ago and I have forgotten much. Has the reliability of Wiki Islam improved? Okay for Surah order that information should be the same everywhere as there is Ijmah on this? So maybe that's not a contentious subject?

Quote:EG: if you read page 1, then jump to page 500, there's nothing telling you which chapter was revealed to prophet Mohammed -peace be upon him- from God first.

OTOH, it is an effective way to get finished with the fucking thing faster.

(November 18, 2018 at 5:58 am)downbeatplumb Wrote:

(November 18, 2018 at 5:20 am)Mr.Obvious Wrote: Interesting hypothesis. Here's mine: people will find ways for holy books to mean whatever alligns with their own views no matter how they are read and, to an extent,  no matter what's even written in them.

Indeed from what I've seen of the koran the language is flowery and vague. 

Allah is a rapper. In Quran Chapter 55, 31 of its 78 verses are the exact same sentence!!

Flowery language? Well, the Creator of the Universe, Allah dedicated an entire short Chapter (111) just to curse Muhammad's uncle & untie  who saw through his baloney & refused to convert.

May the hands of Abu Lahab be ruined, and ruined is he.
His wealth will not avail him or that which he gained.
He will [enter to] burn in a Fire of [blazing] flame
And his wife [as well] - the carrier of firewood.
Around her neck is a rope of [twisted] fiber.

I suppose it is vitally important to know the chronological order of rubbish.

Nah.

Boru

(November 18, 2018 at 2:41 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: The Quran is a big book.

Usually; the reader might question its context and its main goal, just like any other book.
These two questions are the most common, and the reason a reader reads the book from A to Z.

People use the "Chronological Order" to understand the context and the main goal even more; but the Quran doesn't follow a chronological order in terms of chapters.
Yes; that is the first fact about the book.

EG: if you read page 1, then jump to page 500, there's nothing telling you which chapter was revealed to prophet Mohammed -peace be upon him- from God first.

Muslim scholars intervened to categorize the chapters of the Quran without altering the content of the book itself; they left the Quran as it is, but wrote down dates that the chapters were revealed in. You can find the list here:

https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Chronological...e_Qur%27an

Of course, this chronological order -as it is the case with all Islamic literature aside from the Quran- is no more than an attempt from the Muslim scholars.
Prophet Mohammed peace be upon him didn't write this -or order to write it-. He only ordered the Quran itself to be written.

Personally; I think and believe that the Quran must remain like it was revealed. If the prophet didn't order for the chronological order to be followed; then it shouldn't be followed.

The Sunni and Shiite sects use the chronological order stated in the Hadith books -like the order in the link I posted above-. This gives a lot of flexibility to play with the meanings, twist left and right to make a false point true.

It wasn't "revealed anymore than the oracles of Delphi "revealed" anything the Caesars. It is merely another book of mythology that drew off of surrounding and prior religions. It should remain as it is but also be treated for what it really is, a book of old mythology.