I don't think that it was greed or bigotry that put Trump into office. It was just us being us that did it, along with news media that covers politics like a reality show spectator event. We worship wealth and celebrity. We treat politics like entertainment. It is no surprise that a reality television star became president. We set ourselves up for that. And we haven't learned our lesson. Many among us clearly want to select the next president with the same mentality that they would use to choose what person they would most like to see as a reality television show star. "I really like Mayor Pete. I would so totally watch a reality television show with him in it!"

We seem to be determined to aggressively prove that democracy doesn't work. It's no wonder that millennials are saying that they don't have faith in democracy.

Also, it's not too surprising that many anti-Trumpers are feeling a bit disillusioned by their great variety of choice in the upcoming primaries. Trump is the worst that we have had since Andrew Johnson took over from Lincoln. But one thing that has been made abundantly clear by Trump's presidency is that no matter how opposed to it we are, someone else isn't going to make all that much of a difference. We are a nation of posers. We want someone who will pay lip service to all the right things, but won't actually change anything.

(April 26, 2019 at 11:44 am)Yonadav Wrote: We worship wealth and celebrity.

We treat politics like entertainment.

We seem to be determined to aggressively prove that democracy doesn't work.

We are a nation of posers. We want someone who will pay lip service to all the right things, but won't actually change anything.

If we really are as bad as you say, we are already hopeless. What is the purpose of calling us hopeless?

(April 26, 2019 at 1:54 pm)Thoreauvian Wrote:

(April 26, 2019 at 11:44 am)Yonadav Wrote: We worship wealth and celebrity.

We treat politics like entertainment.

We seem to be determined to aggressively prove that democracy doesn't work.

We are a nation of posers. We want someone who will pay lip service to all the right things, but won't actually change anything.

If we really are as bad as you say, we are already hopeless.  What is the purpose of calling us hopeless?

I didn't say that we are hopeless. I don't know that we are hopeless. A made some critical statements about us that are true. Fixing a problem begins with acknowledging the problem. That's the point of making critical statements that are true.

-and yet the problem that gave us a trump was the one thing you didn't acknowledge in that entire post.  

(April 26, 2019 at 2:22 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: -and yet the problem that gave us a trump was the one thing you didn't acknowledge in that entire post.  

Ah, yes. The working class white people in the rust belt who voted to nominate the Reverend Jesse Jackson in 1988. You are correct. I didn't acknowledge them as the problem that gave us Trump.

(April 26, 2019 at 2:08 pm)Yonadav Wrote:

(April 26, 2019 at 1:54 pm)Thoreauvian Wrote:

(April 26, 2019 at 11:44 am)Yonadav Wrote: We worship wealth and celebrity.

We treat politics like entertainment.

We seem to be determined to aggressively prove that democracy doesn't work.

We are a nation of posers. We want someone who will pay lip service to all the right things, but won't actually change anything.

If we really are as bad as you say, we are already hopeless.  What is the purpose of calling us hopeless?

I didn't say that we are hopeless. I don't know that we are hopeless. A made some critical statements about us that are true. Fixing a problem begins with acknowledging the problem. That's the point of making critical statements that are true.

I don't agree that any of your claims are true because they are all over-statements.  You should address specifics and give credit where credit is due.

Here is how I would restate what you wrote:

Wealth and celebrity are entertaining. Few people worship either because they don't take them that seriously.

Because politics is a different word game than ordinary exchanges, it's a ripe target for levity.

Democracy has always had the tendency to be warped by group thinking. It's still better than the other options.

We are a nation of people who strive to be better than we can be realistically, too often because we have been sold some bill of goods.

(April 26, 2019 at 3:36 pm)Thoreauvian Wrote:

(April 26, 2019 at 2:08 pm)Yonadav Wrote: I didn't say that we are hopeless. I don't know that we are hopeless. A made some critical statements about us that are true. Fixing a problem begins with acknowledging the problem. That's the point of making critical statements that are true.

I don't agree that any of your claims are true because they are all over-statements.  You should address specifics and give credit where credit is due.

Here is how I would restate what you wrote:

Wealth and celebrity are entertaining.  Few people worship either because they don't take them that seriously.

Because politics is a different word game than ordinary exchanges, it's a ripe target for levity.

Democracy has always had the tendency to be warped by group thinking.  It's still better than the other options.

We are a nation of people who strive to be better than we can be realistically, too often because we have been sold some bill of goods.

Sounds a bit sanctimonious there, Jay. Saying different things than what I said isn't restating what I said. You disagree with what I said, and that fine. Just say that you don't agree and say what you think. Don't pretend that you are restating my statements when you clearly are not.

(April 26, 2019 at 2:28 pm)Yonadav Wrote:

(April 26, 2019 at 2:22 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: -and yet the problem that gave us a trump was the one thing you didn't acknowledge in that entire post.  

Ah, yes. The working class white people in the rust belt who voted to nominate the Reverend Jesse Jackson in 1988. You are correct. I didn't acknowledge them as the problem that gave us Trump.

Guess we just won't get around to solving it, then, what with how a very smart person said that fixing a problem begins with acknowledging it.

(April 26, 2019 at 4:23 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote:

(April 26, 2019 at 2:28 pm)Yonadav Wrote: Ah, yes. The working class white people in the rust belt who voted to nominate the Reverend Jesse Jackson in 1988. You are correct. I didn't acknowledge them as the problem that gave us Trump.

Guess we just won't get around to solving it, then, what with how a very smart person said that fixing a problem begins with acknowledging it.

Yes, I do encourage you to acknowledge that there is a problem concerning our attitude toward some folks in a former Democratic stronghold that voted to nominate Jesse Jackson for president in 1988.

Oh I know, those poor victims.  Constantly suffering discrimination and rights abrogation, not to mention all that stigma and loss of self esteem at the hands of the libtards...when all they want to do is prevent racial elimination!  

I mean, honestly, who's against preventing racial elimination?  The Racist Left, that's who! MAGA2020!