(June 28, 2019 at 11:06 pm)Succubus Wrote: If you are vaping tobacco what you're doing is called smoking, and you can't smoke tobacco with an E-Cig. Do you mean vaping nicotine? Well you don't have to.
All those rows and rows of vape fluid you see in vape shops and just about everywhere else are mostly comprised of glycerine  with a small percentage of flavouring. By default the vape shop will not sell you fluid containing nicotine, you have to ask for it.

Well, no actually, vaping tobacco would NOT be the same as smoking, just as vaping cannabis is not the same as smoking cannabis. However, I used the word tobacco to refer to the general act of vaping nicotine products because some people have different definitions of what constitutes as an e-cigarette versus a vaporizer, etc. I was just trying to get down to whether people thinking vaping is healthier than smoking in general and assumed people would know what I meant. Hope that clears it up for you.

And I'm not sure what you mean by having to specifically ask for fluid containing nicotine. Things are certainly not like that in the states as nicotine containing fluids for vapes are as readily available as nicotine free vaping liquids.

Less? No.

Different dangers? Yes

(June 28, 2019 at 11:14 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Don't smoke or vape myself. From what little I know about the subject, there's far less information about all the stuff in e-cigs than in regular tobacco. Vaping may or may not be safer than traditional smoking (there may be fewer carcinogens, but the bigger nicotine dose may have its own problems). The one thing that seems certain is that it's not safe in any meaningful way.

And that's where I think we get into an interesting place in defining what's "healthy" and what isn't. Is it safer because you're not inhaling smoke even though you may be more addicted to the higher doses of nicotine contained in a vape pen hit? That's a good question. I think I would rather see people consuming vaporized nicotine than smoke from burned plant material, but arguments can easily be made both ways, especially considering, as you've pointed out, that we don't yet know a lot about the e-cigarettes and related products; in the US a lot of this stuff isn't even FDA regulated yet.

It certainly seems less dangerous to this non-medical professional because you aren't inhaling carcinogenic combustion products into your lungs.

On the other hand, vaping seems to me to be a brilliant marketing plan on the part of the tobacco companies. Nicotine is the addictive ingredient. Now they can enslave you to their product with a believable claim (for now) that it isn't killing you.

Either way, totally amoral companies are profiting on a substance to biologically addict their victims. It's disgusting.

Both the nicotine in cigarettes and in enhanced vape products is problematic as nicotine it is a known vasconstrictor that can lead to or exacerbate cardiovascular issues, and possibly lead to insulin resistance.
However, cigarettes also contain over 7000 chemicals when burned, 250 of which are toxic substances, of which 70 have been proven to cause cancer in humans.

Cigarettes exposes a user to same risks of vaping, plus more. Thus making them more dangerous.

Vape products contain significantly less potentially toxic chemicals. Which by no means makes them safe, of course. 
Vaping does indeed pose health risks, and the vape producers that market it as a healthy alternative or "safe" product are engaging in deception.

But to say that they are "no less" dangerous than cigarettes is incorrect. 
I get that the narrative is being pushed out of concern for misled consumers and non-smoking teens who think vaping is a "harmless" way to be cool, but it is a deception as well.

A well-meaning one, but a deception nonetheless.

I have never understood why anyone would want to breath burning leaves

(June 29, 2019 at 5:41 am)zebo-the-fat Wrote: I have never understood why anyone would want to breath burning leaves

And I can't imagine that introducing nicotine into your respiratory system is in any way is 'healthier' than another.  There simply isn't a 'healthy' level of nicotine.

Boru

Depends on what substance you're vaping. Vaping has expanded to become more than just a nicotine delivery system.

But then, so has smoking.

What I don't understand is why, when vaping people seem to want to produce large amounts of thick white smoke, far more than you would get from a cigarette. Do the want to put up a "flag" saying "look at me. I'm vaping!"

(June 29, 2019 at 5:19 pm)zebo-the-fat Wrote: What I don't understand is why, when vaping people seem to want to produce large amounts of thick white smoke, far more than you would get from a cigarette. Do the want to put up a "flag" saying "look at me. I'm vaping!"

Oh yeah...this seems to be a thing.

Driving past a credit union yesterday I saw a woman come out the door and immediately exhale a cloud that nearly hid her from view.  Before she got to her car (which was quite a short distance) there was another enormous cloud.  She had to have inhaled a lot to have exhaled a bank of fog like that.  Twice in mere seconds it was like seeing a cloud with feet crossing the lot.