(July 30, 2019 at 6:56 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote:

(July 30, 2019 at 6:49 pm)notimportant1234 Wrote: Did you actually read my thread post? 

But I will go on your line. What you are saying is that if you have the misfortune to be a pedophile I should just let you abuse a child and then condemn you to life in prison.

Um, no. If I have the misfortune of being a pedophile, I can go ask for help at any time if I feel like I am not able to control my compulsions. If I choose to indulge my sexual compulsions at the expense of an innocent child rather than seek help, that’s on me. Not society.

Well finally, we are getting somewhere. It took us two pages.

You can't say that social pressure doesn't really affect this, I mean you could just walk in to a hospital, tell a doctor and he could respond "just kill yourself".
What is important in this matter is the attitude towards pedophilia, are people willing to help someone who seeks help or not?

I'm not sure if this is what Not Important is saying, but here's what I think: pedophilia, the way I see it, is a mental illness. Engaging in sexual activities with children is an unambiguously bad thing. However, some pedophiles do not offend. What proportion of the population of pedophiles actually act on those urges? I have no fucking idea, because there's actually been shockingly little research into these non-offending pedophiles. Why? Because, well, there's a stigma on pedophilia (one that, I must keep stressing, makes perfect sense) that even spills over with those who have those feelings and are struggling with the blatant immorality of their desires. Here's a researcher into the subject talking about the misconceptions behind pedophilia, and why it actually makes the struggle to fix it a hell of a lot more difficult than it needs to be.

And Act 2 of this episode of "This American Life" has the testimony of one of those people and he sounds like a kid himself.

Make no mistake, seeing stories like this remind me of this scene from Zootopia



I've said before that when I see this scene, and I see a depressingly long section of my life reflected in it. And, among many, MANY, others, from minority children in shitty situations to women who've been caught doing shit their society doesn't think women should do, I also see Adam. And the prospect of people like him being told there's no point in trying to fix his warped desires utterly disgusts me.

Acceptance of pedophiles must not be confused with acceptance of child molestation. Indeed, said acceptance must hinge on the pedophiles in question desiring to fix their illness. If we can't be bothered to help them keep those desires in check without harming an innocent person, the only thing that's going to happen is more kids getting victimised. Maybe it might all end up with nothing, but if there's still a potential chance that things can be made right, we have to try, at least as long as we care.

It's good to seek help, but, well, the desire is so stigmatised that it can be astonishingly difficult to get up the courage to get help, and it looks like our understanding of how to help with it is still in its infancy.

(July 30, 2019 at 7:00 pm)notimportant1234 Wrote:

(July 30, 2019 at 6:56 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: Um, no. If I have the misfortune of being a pedophile, I can go ask for help at any time if I feel like I am not able to control my compulsions. If I choose to indulge my sexual compulsions at the expense of an innocent child rather than seek help, that’s on me. Not society.

Well finally, we are getting somewhere. It took us two pages.

You can't say that social pressure doesn't really affect this, I mean you could just walk in to a hospital, tell a doctor and he could respond "just kill yourself".
What is important in this matter is the attitude towards pedophilia, are people willing to help someone who seeks help or not?

Really? The practicing MD is going to tell the pedophile to kill himself rather than do his job? He would risk his license to practice as well as the life of a potential child victim? What about 911? Suicide hot lines? The local PD? No. You don’t get to blame a pedophile’s actions on society’s appropriate attitude toward child rape. I mean, what’s you’re suggested solution here?

Positive thinking, thus far.

I doubt therapy is adequate at helping these people, and (from what I've seen on psychforums, if it's any indication) pedophiles tend to rationalize their urges rather than seek help for it.

I think what is needed as a solution to address an issue like this is technology not yet available (something similar to the stuff in A Clockwork Orange). Radical but a necessity in this case.

(July 30, 2019 at 7:07 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Positive thinking, thus far.

Enlighten us then.

(July 30, 2019 at 7:05 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote:

(July 30, 2019 at 7:00 pm)notimportant1234 Wrote: Well finally, we are getting somewhere. It took us two pages.

You can't say that social pressure doesn't really affect this, I mean you could just walk in to a hospital, tell a doctor and he could respond "just kill yourself".
What is important in this matter is the attitude towards pedophilia, are people willing to help someone who seeks help or not?

Really? The practicing MD is going to tell the pedophile to kill himself rather than do his job? He would risk his license to practice as well as the life of a potential child victim? What about 911? Suicide hot lines? The local PD? No. You don’t get to blame a pedophile’s actions on society’s appropriate attitude toward child rape. I mean, what’s you’re suggested solution here?

Now, if you really had read my posts from the beginning, I didn't imply that we should have a positive outlook on child rape. What I sayed? How do we tackle the problem of prevention, because from what I see, at least in my country, people are concentrating on the after only. 

And about the blame part, if I would have made a thread about free will, a lot of you would have sayed it is childish, now that we are tackling a more emotional driven topic, everybody chooses the hell out of his live.

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(July 30, 2019 at 7:07 pm)Grandizer Wrote: I doubt therapy is adequate at helping these people, and (from what I've seen on psychforums, if it's any indication) pedophiles tend to rationalize their urges rather than seek help for it.

I think what is needed as a solution to address an issue like this is technology not yet available (something similar to the stuff in A Clockwork Orange). Radical but a necessity in this case.

I think that virtual reality could help and it is not that far away.

(July 30, 2019 at 7:14 pm)notimportant1234 Wrote: I think that virtual reality could help and it is not that far away.

If you're thinking of what I'm thinking of, I suspect that could go either way, either being an effective safety valve or just a way to embolden them. A lot of research would have to be done to be prove it either way.

(July 30, 2019 at 7:19 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote:

(July 30, 2019 at 7:14 pm)notimportant1234 Wrote: I think that virtual reality could help and it is not that far away.

If you're thinking of what I'm thinking of, I suspect that could go either way, either being an effective safety valve or just a way to embolden them. A lot of research would have to be done to be prove it either way.

Well, everything has to be tested before it becomes a standard. Maybe if we manage to trick the brain well enough it will work, given the knowledge that we posses now, it is pretty much the best thing we have for a treatment.

The pedo's are not going to come forward on their own, look at the priesthood.

If they did come forward then they'd need to be isolated from contact with potential victims. I've not read/heard of any effective treatment or deterrent. You could consider castration but even that is not acceptably effective. 

It appears that Germany is trying a combo of pharmacological and CBT but I don't know how effective it is. :https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/condi...pedophilia