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September 8, 2020 at 9:26 pm (This post was last modified: September 8, 2020 at 9:57 pm by popeyespappy.)
(September 8, 2020 at 12:46 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: And any jury verdict based on whether a particular law is ‘fair’ is likely to be set aside by the presiding judge or cause a mistrial.
Mistrial maybe, but a US Judge can not set aside an acquittal. They can only enter a judgment notwithstanding the verdict if the jury votes to convict. A judge in a jury trial can only convict without the consent of the jury if the defendant waives their rights to a jury trial.
Quote:Jury verdicts are meant to be based on the facts in evidence and whether those facts merit action under established law.
I guess this means you are OK with condemning a young black man to 25 to life in prison because he got caught 3 times with 25 grams of pot and ran afoul of the three-strikes law? I'm not, and if I am sitting on the jury in such a case I won't vote to convict in such a case regardless of whether or not the facts merit action under established law. I don't have to either. John Jay, the first Chief Justice of the US Supreme Court, said in Georgia v Brailsford that jurors possess a right to determine the law as well as the fact in controversy. This has been confirmed by the courts as late as 1972 in US v. Dougherty when the District of Columbia Court of Appeals explained that a jury has an unreviewable and irreversible power to acquit and disregard of the instruction on the law given by the trial judge. Jury nullification is a thing. While a Judge can remove a juror or declare a mistrial in the event of a hung jury, they cannot declare someone guilty without either the unanimous consent of the jury or the defendant.
Haven't been following the discussion in this thread. Only want to post what is showing up on the kids funding site.
3
Hello all,
I'm writing you today with more frustrating news. We just learned that Discover is planning to cut off the ability of its cardholders to make payments to this fundraiser; this development unfortunately follows days of relentless targeting by big tech on the order of Facebook, Twitter, Stripe, and Instagram. Other credit card companies are likekly to follow, unless a strong message is sent to all of these globalist-controlled corporations that we are not willing to sit by while they erase our Freedom of Speech through their un-American accounting practices. I encourage all of you to contact them through their website, and where able, make personal statements by taking your business elsewhere. We will likely be figuring out alternative ways to donate soon, and I will keep you posted.
Congratulations! We not only made it to our initial goal of a $200K, we've now made it to our stretch of a quarter million dollars! That's absolutely fantastic, and it's all thanks to how wonderful yall are! I really am blown away by the genorosity you've all displayed, and from what I've heard, so is Kyle. We couldn't have done this without you, so, from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much. Let's see if we can make to $500K!
On a closer-to-home note, it has come to our attention that GiveSendGo has had their links banned from Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. While the legality of this action is questionable, it is unfortunately the world in which we live – to that, I say, email and text! They may try to censor us and deprive us of the ability to help people, but that's the thing about light; it always gets in. I know that with your continued help, this campaign and this website will continue to enjoy the success to which they are entitled, for their vigorous defense of the American Right to Freedom of Speech. If you have the chance, give them a good tip, as they've been fantastic hosts! The money is on it's way to Lin, and we couldn't be happier!
Hope you're all having a great day,
~Rob
1
Hello all,
Allow me to begin by thanking you all so much for your generous contributions to helping secure Kyle's freedom! We live in dark times, but the generosity and positivity that all of you have shown is the "light of the world" needed to drive out the darkness. Through your kindness, you are making an incredible difference in this young man's life.
I have just spoken with Kyle's mother, Wendy, and Kyle's attorney, John, to whom I was connected by Lin Wood (Chris Sandmann's attorney), who has also joined the legal team. Wendy has instructed me to transfer the money from GiveSendGo's holding account to the #FightBack Foundation, set up by Lin Wood. All of the money donated through both their website, and this effort, will go to Kyle's defense, as it is likely to be an expensive and protracted affair.
Kyle is reportedly in good spirits, and I'm told that the incredible support shown by you good people is what's keeping him going.
We have all seen the hatred that has threatened our country in recent months, and in Kyle we have seen the courage against chaos that we all desire to see within our own hearts. This young man has reinvigorated the faith of many that this country and its founding principles are indeed founded upon the rock, not built upon the sand.
However, a city upon a hill cannot be hid; Kyle now faces the wrath of those who would see us stripped of our God-given rights and reduced to servitude. He is in dire need of our help. Kyle will likely need significant amounts of cash to post bail; for this reason, this fundraiser will be ongoing. His success is our success; his failure, the loss of our right to self-defense. I firmly believe that with the continued support of all of you fine people, Kyle will be freed.
God bless America, God bless you, and #FreeKyle
~Rob
(September 8, 2020 at 11:27 pm)brewer Wrote: Haven't been following the discussion in this thread. Only want to post what is showing up on the kids funding site.
3
Hello all,
I'm writing you today with more frustrating news. We just learned that Discover is planning to cut off the ability of its cardholders to make payments to this fundraiser; this development unfortunately follows days of relentless targeting by big tech on the order of Facebook, Twitter, Stripe, and Instagram. Other credit card companies are likekly to follow, unless a strong message is sent to all of these globalist-controlled corporations that we are not willing to sit by while they erase our Freedom of Speech through their un-American accounting practices. I encourage all of you to contact them through their website, and where able, make personal statements by taking your business elsewhere. We will likely be figuring out alternative ways to donate soon, and I will keep you posted.
Congratulations! We not only made it to our initial goal of a $200K, we've now made it to our stretch of a quarter million dollars! That's absolutely fantastic, and it's all thanks to how wonderful yall are! I really am blown away by the genorosity you've all displayed, and from what I've heard, so is Kyle. We couldn't have done this without you, so, from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much. Let's see if we can make to $500K!
On a closer-to-home note, it has come to our attention that GiveSendGo has had their links banned from Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. While the legality of this action is questionable, it is unfortunately the world in which we live – to that, I say, email and text! They may try to censor us and deprive us of the ability to help people, but that's the thing about light; it always gets in. I know that with your continued help, this campaign and this website will continue to enjoy the success to which they are entitled, for their vigorous defense of the American Right to Freedom of Speech. If you have the chance, give them a good tip, as they've been fantastic hosts! The money is on it's way to Lin, and we couldn't be happier!
Hope you're all having a great day,
~Rob
1
Hello all,
Allow me to begin by thanking you all so much for your generous contributions to helping secure Kyle's freedom! We live in dark times, but the generosity and positivity that all of you have shown is the "light of the world" needed to drive out the darkness. Through your kindness, you are making an incredible difference in this young man's life.
I have just spoken with Kyle's mother, Wendy, and Kyle's attorney, John, to whom I was connected by Lin Wood (Chris Sandmann's attorney), who has also joined the legal team. Wendy has instructed me to transfer the money from GiveSendGo's holding account to the #FightBack Foundation, set up by Lin Wood. All of the money donated through both their website, and this effort, will go to Kyle's defense, as it is likely to be an expensive and protracted affair.
Kyle is reportedly in good spirits, and I'm told that the incredible support shown by you good people is what's keeping him going.
We have all seen the hatred that has threatened our country in recent months, and in Kyle we have seen the courage against chaos that we all desire to see within our own hearts. This young man has reinvigorated the faith of many that this country and its founding principles are indeed founded upon the rock, not built upon the sand.
However, a city upon a hill cannot be hid; Kyle now faces the wrath of those who would see us stripped of our God-given rights and reduced to servitude. He is in dire need of our help. Kyle will likely need significant amounts of cash to post bail; for this reason, this fundraiser will be ongoing. His success is our success; his failure, the loss of our right to self-defense. I firmly believe that with the continued support of all of you fine people, Kyle will be freed.
God bless America, God bless you, and #FreeKyle
~Rob
September 9, 2020 at 7:18 am (This post was last modified: September 9, 2020 at 7:20 am by Silver.)
In a nutshell, the Kyle Rittenhouse situation is just a bunch of Christians supporting a young boy. Keep in mind that the young boy should have been parented better whereby he wasn't parading around with a loaded weapon. For fucks sake, these adults supporting him are not adults. They're enablers, for a screwed up faith system and an even worse gun system. Nothing more.
September 9, 2020 at 8:45 am (This post was last modified: September 9, 2020 at 8:49 am by Belacqua.)
(September 9, 2020 at 7:18 am)Eleven Wrote: an even worse gun system
I think Marx's idea of commodity fetishism goes a long way toward explaining American gun idiocy.
As you know, Marx describes commodity fetishism as the illusion that a thing you can buy possesses qualities that only a living person can actually have.
So for example, a person can be sophisticated, by having had certain kinds of experiences and certain kinds of subtle wisdom. A watch, for example, can't be sophisticated; it can only tell time and look nice. But a watch becomes a fetish when we start to think that it contains sophistication, and that if we buy it we are buying sophistication.
The actual use value of the watch is to tell time, and a Casio is probably as good as a Rolex. But the exchange value depends on its being a fetish -- we think we are buying sophistication or some other human quality. Likewise cars, fashion, etc. We select them largely for the fetish value.
Likewise, a gun has only one use value -- to kill people. It is a tool for killing people. But in the US it has become an extreme fetish, in which people think that by buying a gun they are purchasing things like power and freedom. In fact, a gun doesn't have or bestow freedom. Only a person can have freedom, if he can do what he chooses. But since the economic and political systems in America keep most people largely unfree, we substitute fetish (fake) freedom instead. Buy a gun and feel you're purchasing freedom, although you're not.
I think that poor idiots like Rittenhouse are fetishists. He got the idea that by carrying his gun around he would have certain human qualities, like freedom or power or patriotism or security. But in the end the gun was only a tool for killing, and that's all it did.
September 9, 2020 at 8:58 am (This post was last modified: September 9, 2020 at 8:58 am by BrianSoddingBoru4.)
Quote:Likewise, a gun has only one use value -- to kill people.
Nonsense. A gun can be used to procure food, to target shoot, for trophy hunting, as a threat, etc.
With a bit of ingenuity, there is nothing that has only one use value. This why I sometimes use books to prop up a table, or a handy shoe to bang in a nail.
I do agree about the fetishism, thought. There are plenty of people who own objects out of some sort of emotional or status value beyond that object's utility.
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
September 9, 2020 at 9:11 am (This post was last modified: September 9, 2020 at 9:40 am by brewer.)
(September 9, 2020 at 7:14 am)arewethereyet Wrote: Perhaps my memory of religious rules is a little hazy, but isn't there something about not killing people as one of the main rules?
I will never understand the contortions religious whackos will go through to make things fit with their "faith".
Unless he was on a mission from god.
This kid has wanted to draw down on someone for years. The call to arms gave him the excuse.
(September 9, 2020 at 8:58 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
Quote:Likewise, a gun has only one use value -- to kill people.
Nonsense. A gun can be used to procure food, to target shoot, for trophy hunting, as a threat, etc.
With a bit of ingenuity, there is nothing that has only one use value. This why I sometimes use books to prop up a table, or a handy shoe to bang in a nail.
I do agree about the fetishism, thought. There are plenty of people who own objects out of some sort of emotional or status value beyond that object's utility.
Boru
Yeah. The generalized use value of a gun is what someone uses it for. A hammer has better use value to hammer in nails into a wood plank than a shoe does, but I think you can't reasonable say the same about a gun at similar instances of different uses. Looking at other stuff than only use value, then guns carry with them more serious implications along with their use value, such as higher lethality use than, say, a knife.
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