Aimed at any theist who believes there are objective morals & that God can command what he likes whenever he likes (Drich, my man):

Congratulations, you are having your cake and eating it. This "objective morals+" is in fact subject to change whenever one is "righteous" and does God's will which, as history can point out, can range from smiting the unbeliever to setting up charities for the poor. Therefore, morality is subjective, because evidently these "objective standards" fluctuate even if you believe in your god, and you will do according to what seems right in your current context.

I'm not a believer in objective morals myself, but I don't see why an objective morality couldn't have differing rules for differing contexts and still be objective.

If God decides what is moral and what is not, that is subjective morality.

For me, whatever God says is moral becomes moral, and whatever He says is immoral becomes immoral.

(March 11, 2013 at 12:35 pm)mo66 Wrote: For me, whatever God says is moral becomes moral, and whatever He says is immoral becomes immoral.

Then, as Ryan said, you reject the idea of objective moral standards.

A being, however wise or powerful, decides = subjective.

(March 11, 2013 at 12:35 pm)mo66 Wrote: For me, whatever God says is moral becomes moral, and whatever He says is immoral becomes immoral.

So if god said murder was morally good, would you also think so?

Oh, and saying "god would never do that", is a cop out.

(March 11, 2013 at 1:18 pm)Napoléon Wrote:

(March 11, 2013 at 12:35 pm)mo66 Wrote: For me, whatever God says is moral becomes moral, and whatever He says is immoral becomes immoral.

So if god said murder was morally good, would you also think so?

Oh, and saying "god would never do that", is a cop out.

Murder by definition is wrong since it means "unlawful killing". But if you said that God says killing is morally good, then yes, killing becomes morally good.

(March 11, 2013 at 1:27 pm)mo66 Wrote: Murder by definition is wrong since it means "unlawful killing". But if you said that God says killing is morally good, then yes, killing becomes morally good.

the quoran sais that people who leave islam deserve to be stoned.

will you follow that command?

(March 11, 2013 at 1:05 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:

(March 11, 2013 at 12:35 pm)mo66 Wrote: For me, whatever God says is moral becomes moral, and whatever He says is immoral becomes immoral.

Then, as Ryan said, you reject the idea of objective moral standards.

A being, however wise or powerful, decides = subjective.

Well, I don't know the exact criteria of what constitutes as objective morality, but for me God is always correct in His decisions because of His attributes. Maybe it's a bit like someone 5000 years ago saying that the Earth isn't flat or something, at which point it is a subjective statement, but what makes it objective are later breakthroughs in physics and astronomy. I don't know whether that's an accurate analogy, just putting it out there.

(March 11, 2013 at 1:27 pm)mo66 Wrote: But if you said that God says killing is morally good, then yes, killing becomes morally good.