It occurs to me that I could have answered this completely differently.


This may paint me in an unfavorable light, for one reason or another, but as we used to say in gaming, "No guts, no glory."

One of my religions, Taoism, is heavily canted towards what is known as the ethics of virtue. (Supposedly Aristotle was a proponent of virtue based ethics, but I haven't read him.) The basic principle of virtue based ethics is that rules (deontological) and outcomes (consequentialism) are not the most important goal of ethics; virtue is. I believe in virtue ethics. As such, I concentrate on cultivating virtue in myself and others. That's my politics. Cultivate virtue first; cultivate the world second. Work as hard as you can at being a good, ethical, virtuous person, and helping others do the same, and the world will be changed.


The highest good is like water.
Water give life to the ten thousand things and does not strive.
It flows in places men reject and so is like the Tao.
In dwelling, be close to the land.
In meditation, go deep in the heart.
In dealing with others, be gentle and kind.
In speech, be true.
In ruling, be just.
In daily life, be competent.
In action, be aware of the time and the season.

No fight: No blame.

The sage stays behind, thus she is ahead.
She is detached, thus at one with all.
Through selfless action, she attains fulfillment.

Libertarian.

(March 15, 2013 at 11:06 am)jstrodel Wrote: Your attitude is evidence for my personal belief that society should try and teach virtue. This is really sort of boring though. Do you have an argument, or just a lot of name calling?

If you want to see where I am on the left-right spectrum, it is sort of like Alaisdair MacIntyre reading Milton Friedman. But you don't know who those people are, you just know that I'm an idiot because you don't understand my position.

What objective "virtue" are you spouting off about suddenly? What virtue is 100% objectively applicable to everyone? Does it include bowing on your knees before God? If so then it's not very objective because I object to it, and therefore your personal beliefs are worthless on this point. And that WAS an argument; it was an argument that what you are spouting is a loud of crap. MacIntyre reading Friedman? Are you fucking HIGH? Neither of those two guys' views ever were compatible and they still aren't. Stop trying to square the circle; you just have no fucking clue where your compass is actually pointing, so you just start pointing in random directions, spouting whatever word comes to mind when you do, in the hopes of sounding intelligent and finally giving some credibility to your stances and positions, except it's failing horribly and doing the complete opposite. You cannot say "I am pro freedom," and then immediately follow with "Mandatory religious education." So you're pro freedom except for the freedom to choose, huh? Clever of you to circumvent it by "education," thus ensuring that you can get to brainwash the children as early as possible. I'm onto your bullshit.

You also cannot say that you are libertarian in economic views, and then say you're also socialist in economic views. These are two COMPLETELY clashing ideologies that are not compatible with each other in the real world at ALL.

Also your little quip about how I probably don't know who fucking Alasdair Chalmers MacIntyre is is fucking insulting and presumptuous as shit. He was a weak-willed man who had to struggle with what is now out-of-date information and was convinced of divinity by Augustine, a man renowned for saying shit like this:

Quote:"The good Christian should beware of mathematicians and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and confine man in the bonds of Hell."

"All diseases of Christians are to be ascribed to demons; chiefly do they torment freshly-baptized Christians, yea, even the guiltless new-born infants."

"Nothing is so much to be shunned as sex relations."

"Women should not be enlightened or educated in any way. They should, in fact, be segregated as they are the cause
of hideous and involuntary erections in holy men."

"It is impossible that there should be inhabitants on the opposite side of the Earth, since no such race is recorded by Scripture among the descendants of Adam."

Hey, he sounds like someone YOU venerate!

You don't even know what a socialist is. Why argue with someone who thinks socialism just means moving money around?

Uh, neither do you, apparently. Socialism is when the governing body takes or holds control of most or all bodies of the average citizen's essentials or luxuries. An example of economic socialism is where all corporations ultimately are owned by the government, where the government has direct say in all or at least most of the business dealings of all companies, or where the government can create its own companies to compete against private owners with their own resources, which can be limitless. That's economic socialism, which is what you're talking about, which is NOT FUCKING COMPATIBLE with libertarian economics wherein the government has minimal, IF ANY say or control or regulation over business matters, trade, and economic shifts, you dolt! You're saying you have views on the economy that involve government-run or backed corporations competing in a marketplace where the government doesn't and cannot take any interest or backing in the marketplace. Quit your presumptuous bullshit and quit dancing around my points, quit throwing up red herrings and address these points or just concede that you're a directionless twit.

Have you ever heard of the IWW? Do you know what a syndicalist is? Do you know how many conservatives there are in labor unions?

You have a small mind and you haven't thought about this that much. Just shut up. I have thought about this more than you have. Just shut up, unless you have a real argument to make. I know perfectly well what state socialism is.

Socialism is when the working class owns the means of production. You have a small minded view of socialism. You think France is an example of a socialist country. Whatever. Just shut up.

Technically, France is closer to a socialist country than most other countries.

There is no absolute "socialist" country, anymore than the United States is an absolute "capitalist" country (fun fact, the US struggles with policies that endorse corporate welfare -- slightly in league with oligarchies and fascist dictatorships, while trying to provide state subsidized healthcare -- a form of socialism).

(March 16, 2013 at 12:17 pm)jstrodel Wrote: You have a small mind and you haven't thought about this that much. Just shut up. I have thought about this more than you have. Just shut up, unless you have a real argument to make. I know perfectly well what state socialism is.

I see one potential count of trolling. Better consult one of your fellow Christians before you start really digging a hole here...

here we cal what you call liberterians "liberals"

So why do you call them liberterian?

(March 16, 2013 at 1:58 pm)Moros Synackaon Wrote: Technically, France is closer to a socialist country than most other countries.

There is no absolute "socialist" country, anymore than the United States is an absolute "capitalist" country (fun fact, the US struggles with policies that endorse corporate welfare -- slightly in league with oligarchies and fascist dictatorships, while trying to provide state subsidized healthcare -- a form of socialism).

You are accepting a definition of socialism that refers to the state controlling more of the economy. This is one definition.

If you have studied the history of radicalism at all, you will realize very quickly there are many different movements. Many of them virulently reject the liberal synthesis of socialism and capitalism.

Of course. And I wish you had posted that instead of "just shut up" as you did to Creed.

We understand insults will be thrown around and emotions will run high, but we require that you respond to the discussion and contribute in a positive manner if you're going to throw around a few "fuck you"s and, in your case, "shut up"s.

That is all.