Although I have chosen to create this thread in the Christian section, the question I am posing is primarily directed toward non-Christians. Christians have an obligation to believe that Jesus was either god himself or god's son.

For anyone else, that claim is probably absurd. With that, I'd like to get some theories about who Jesus was exactly.

As I see it, there are two basic possibilties:

1. He very well could have been a real person who created a new religious movement. This may or may not have been his intent. Perhaps he was merely a man who tired of the Jewish religion, and felt compelled to introduce some new ideas about heaven, hell, and salvation.

2. He may not have existed at all. There certainly isn't any compelling evidence to support a real historical figure matching the description of the character of Jesus Christ. If he didn't exist, which is a very real possibility, how did such a character come to be invented?

As I said, these are the two basic ideas, but I'm introducing this subject to further explore these ideas or introduce other possibiltiies.

Thoughts?

Jesus wasn't.

No more than Hercules, Zeus, Odin, Quetzlcoatl, etc.

(August 24, 2013 at 7:05 pm)smax Wrote: Although I have chosen to create this thread in the Christian section, the question I am posing is primarily directed toward non-Christians. Christians have an obligation to believe that Jesus was either god himself or god's son.
<snip>

Thoughts?

Proof of claim?
.

(August 24, 2013 at 7:20 pm)catfish Wrote:

(August 24, 2013 at 7:05 pm)smax Wrote: Although I have chosen to create this thread in the Christian section, the question I am posing is primarily directed toward non-Christians. Christians have an obligation to believe that Jesus was either god himself or god's son.
<snip>

Thoughts?

Proof of claim?
.

The Bible?

(August 24, 2013 at 7:05 pm)smax Wrote: Although I have chosen to create this thread in the Christian section, the question I am posing is primarily directed toward non-Christians. Christians have an obligation to believe that Jesus was either god himself or god's son.

For anyone else, that claim is probably absurd. With that, I'd like to get some theories about who Jesus was exactly.

As I see it, there are two basic possibilties:

1. He very well could have been a real person who created a new religious movement. This may or may not have been his intent. Perhaps he was merely a man who tired of the Jewish religion, and felt compelled to introduce some new ideas about heaven, hell, and salvation.

2. He may not have existed at all. There certainly isn't any compelling evidence to support a real historical figure matching the description of the character of Jesus Christ. If he didn't exist, which is a very real possibility, how did such a character come to be invented?

As I said, these are the two basic ideas, but I'm introducing this subject to further explore these ideas or introduce other possibiltiies.

Thoughts?

Obviously I'm a Christian... but as an observer?

How could Jesus have so much pump after 2000 years, unless He indeed rose from the dead. I don't believe anyone has pulled that stunt yet!

Not-to-mention the many followers that saw Jesus afterwards, and were willing to die horrible deaths themselves fearlessly witnessing for Him.

As far as the historic mentions of Jesus. There are some... but Christianity was persecuted. And why wouldn't they try to wipe out any mention of Him. The followers went underground for 300 years! Who would be openly writing about Jesus? Unless of course he wanted to be fed to Lions or crucified!

I think that the two possibilities are possible.
If he did existed there are many questions :

1.Who was his father ? (Joseph , Panthera [we find that in the Talmud therefore this is rather few reliable but maybe that this is true] , Parthenogenesis , another person etc...).
2.He believed really what he said or he was a manipulator ?
3.If he was crucified did he survive to the crucification ?
4.Where are from the belief to his ressurection ?
5.Ask others questions.

(August 24, 2013 at 8:02 pm)ronedee Wrote: How could Jesus have so much pump after 2000 years, unless He indeed rose from the dead. I don't believe anyone has pulled that stunt yet!

I totally agree. Non sequitur notwithstanding.

(August 24, 2013 at 7:27 pm)BadWriterSparty Wrote:

(August 24, 2013 at 7:20 pm)catfish Wrote: Proof of claim?
.

The Bible?

Then quote it. Bare assertions abound 'round these here parts, ya know?

(August 24, 2013 at 8:14 pm)Stimbo Wrote:

(August 24, 2013 at 8:02 pm)ronedee Wrote: How could Jesus have so much pump after 2000 years, unless He indeed rose from the dead. I don't believe anyone has pulled that stunt yet!

I totally agree. Non sequitur notwithstanding.

Actually, the Eleusinan mystery cults were popular for close to 2,000 years. Taoism is a major force in China, 2,500 years after the fact. Buddhism is also a major religion in Asia, again, 2,500 years on. And the roots of contemporary Hinduism stretch back anywhere from 3,000 to 40,000 years. And this is even ignoring the fact that Christianity has stiff competition from, of all places, itself! The Catholic church, once the defining branch of Christianity, is losing ground yearly to the new kid on the block, Protestantism. And the Catholic church itself is a result of the Great Schism of 1054, so realistically, the modern Catholic church is less than a 1,000 years old. And even this is nothing given the fact that people with no religion have likely existed as long as there have been humans to be non-religious. Beat that for longevity!

That Christianity has had unusual longevity is a myth perpetrated by Christians themselves. Just like a Christian to use a false claim to prop up an argument that wouldn't mean anything even if it was true.

(August 24, 2013 at 8:34 pm)catfish Wrote:

(August 24, 2013 at 7:27 pm)BadWriterSparty Wrote: The Bible?

Then quote it. Bare assertions abound 'round these here parts, ya know?

Since the central tenet of Christianity is that jesus is the son of god, god or both.
How can you be a Christian and not believe it?