(November 9, 2013 at 10:19 am)Simon Moon Wrote:

(October 20, 2013 at 8:52 pm)arvind13 Wrote: Atheism is a late bloom of a Christian passion for truth.

Atheism has been around for as long as the claim that gods exist has been. Long before Christianity.

"Among the six orthodox schools of Hindu philosophy, Samkhya, the oldest philosophical school of thought, does not accept God, and the early Mimamsa also rejected the notion of God.The thoroughly materialistic and anti-theistic philosophical Cārvāka (also called Nastika or Lokaiata) school that originated in India around the 6th century BCE is probably the most explicitly atheistic school of philosophy in India, similar to the Greek Cyrenaic school (435 BCE)."

thanks for the welcome Kayenneh and Minimalist. sorry for the late reply. life got in the way

thanks for engaging in the discussion, Simon Moon. You see, the 'fact' that that atheism is found all over the world, only makes sense if one assumes that religion is found all over the world i.e a cultural universal. Most (99.99999%) anthropologists agree that this is the case. But there is new research coming out challenging this assumption that religion is found in all (or most) societies.

Does India even have native religions? What is Hinduism anyways? Hindu philosophy? Because if India doesn't have religion, then rejection of 'God', 'gods', 'materialistic' philosophy makes no sense.

and please don't misunderstand my questions or the level of discussion I'm aiming at. I'm not trolling or trying to incite people.

I'm looking at this issue from a meta level. I'm questioning the whole paradigm and theoretical framework we use to look at 'religion', 'religions', and culture

I'm glad there is an Indian atheist on this forum too. It will make the discussion more interesting.

(October 20, 2013 at 8:52 pm)arvind13 Wrote: Here is an interesting quote from philosopher John Gray from his book Straw Dogs:

"To Deny the existence of God is to accept the categories [framework] of monotheism. As these categories fall into disuse, unbelief becomes uninteresting. Atheists say they want a secular world, but a world defined by the absence of the Christian God is still a Christian world. Secularism is like chastity, a condition defined by what it denies. If atheism has a future, it can only be in a Christian world.

Atheism is a late bloom of a Christian passion for truth. No Pagan is ready to sacrifice the pleasure of life for the sake of mere truth. The long delayed consequence of Christian faith was an idolatry of truth that found its most complete expression in Atheism."

Hi guys. I just joined this forum. I thought this quote was fascinating and would be interesting to reflect upon and discuss about.

To me, this is much like saying there would be no reason to apply good reason to promoting the equality of women, once women become equal.

or, there would be no reason to fight discrimination if slavery is abolished.

Of course there are no terms such as A-oppressionist, or A-slavest. I imagine that if there was still an overwhelming support for ideas of this sort, the reasonable people that reflect on them may have needed to coin such terms.

Unfortunately, not all bad ideas take only a number of decades to revise...

Religion is a genuinely bad idea that has existed and evolved since man first began to ponder his existence. And it has infected the minds and agendas of governments, and other institutions which use it as a reason to do evil in its defense. Atheism represents a glimmer of reason in a world that insists on promoting bad ideas.

Hopefully, one day we will be able to look back on Christianity and all other superstitions in much the same way that we look back on the Greek gods and other myths. Then the term Atheism will dissolve away as an unnecessary word in the absence of Theism.

The only way this will come into fruition is through critical thinking and reason. Atheism is the byproduct of these tools being aimed at religion, and the honest reflection of the results it produces.

Religion is not the only thing these tools are useful for. Nor are genuinely bad ideas exclusive to religion. As long as people are promoting bad ideas, the pillars of what leads one to Atheism-reason and logic-will always have a useful role in society.

That's my opinion anyway.

(November 9, 2013 at 10:19 am)Simon Moon Wrote:

(October 20, 2013 at 8:52 pm)arvind13 Wrote: Atheism is a late bloom of a Christian passion for truth.

Atheism has been around for as long as the claim that gods exist has been. Long before Christianity.

"Among the six orthodox schools of Hindu philosophy, Samkhya, the oldest philosophical school of thought, does not accept God, and the early Mimamsa also rejected the notion of God.The thoroughly materialistic and anti-theistic philosophical Cārvāka (also called Nastika or Lokaiata) school that originated in India around the 6th century BCE is probably the most explicitly atheistic school of philosophy in India, similar to the Greek Cyrenaic school (435 BCE)."

thanks for the welcome Kayenneh and Minimalist. sorry for the late reply. life got in the way

thanks for engaging in the discussion, Simon Moon. You see, the 'fact' that that atheism is found all over the world, only makes sense if one assumes that religion is found all over the world i.e a cultural universal. Most (99.99999%) anthropologists agree that this is the case. But there is new research coming out challenging this assumption that religion is found in all (or most) societies.

Does India even have native religions? What is Hinduism anyways? Hindu philosophy? Because if India doesn't have religion, then rejection of 'God', 'gods', 'materialistic' philosophy makes no sense.

and please don't misunderstand my questions or the level of discussion I'm aiming at. I'm not trolling or trying to incite people.

I'm looking at this issue from a meta level. I'm questioning the whole paradigm and theoretical framework we use to look at 'religion', 'religions', and culture

I'm glad there is an Indian atheist on this forum too. It will make the discussion more interesting.

I'm pretty sure Hinduism is a form of Polytheism, I honestly don't know much about it. Apo will know what to tell you if she sees this. I also don't know for certain, but I think it's native origin is India as well.

---

"Atheism is nothing more than the noises reasonable people make in the presence of unjustified religious beliefs.”

-Sam Harris

can you see my post? I'm asking because my last two posts I can't see it. are others having the same problem?

This is typical Christian rhetoric in which the Christian is deluded into believing the whole world revolves around their religion.

Reality has never been their strong suit.

It's the anti-reality. I think the lack of correlation with the objective is kind of a key component in any unfalsifiable hypothesis. If it could be shown to be false, it wouldn't be any fun trying to perpetuate their delusions in arenas such as this.

(November 10, 2013 at 2:42 pm)Faith No More Wrote: This is typical Christian rhetoric in which the Christian is deluded into believing the whole world revolves around their religion.

Reality has never been their strong suit.

thanks for fixing my posts faith no more. What caused the problem?

You had your quote tags messed up. If you don't have an equal amount of open and closed quote tags, your post won't show up. You need one closed quote [*/quote] (without the '*') for every open quote [*quote] (without the '*'), or a bug in the software causes the post to be blank.

(November 10, 2013 at 11:48 am)arvind13 Wrote: thanks for the welcome Kayenneh and Minimalist. sorry for the late reply. life got in the way

Yeah, life happens. Good that you have your priorities straight, real life should always come before internet life