(December 1, 2014 at 11:11 pm)Losty Wrote: I'm of the belief that god is a fairytale and I wish to discuss human morality. God is irrelevant.

Some people are filled with hate towards others. For example, ISIS have a total disregard for human life and are driven by hate towards people of different sects and religions.

I don't know how you can see them as not evil people.

(December 1, 2014 at 11:18 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(December 1, 2014 at 11:11 pm)Losty Wrote: I'm of the belief that god is a fairytale and I wish to discuss human morality. God is irrelevant.

Some people are filled with hate towards others. For example, ISIS have a total disregard for human life and are driven by hate towards people of different sects and religions.

I don't know how you can see them as not evil people.

Maybe it's because I see too much of myself in them and I don't like to think of myself as evil. I've never killed anyone or intentionally harmed anyone, but my mind was once poisoned by religion too. I could see absolutely nothing beyond the lenses my parents and church elders hand crafted for me.
It's just a tiny comparison seeing as they're murdering people left and right and I wouldn't hurt anyone not even in the name of my god when I was still Christian.
But then...I don't know them. I don't know the horrors they may have lived. I don't understand their minds. I don't know why they are the way they are. Maybe they're monsters...but they're also people. I don't see them as any less deserving of compassion. Who am I to say they're bad people? I can't understand them and if I can't understand them, then who am I to say if they're evil or not?

I don't think anyone is bad. Maybe fucked in the head or misguided, but I don't think anyone goes out of their way to do evil. They just do what they think is best for the situation they face.

That is exactly how I feel. Even people who do horrible evil things must either think it's right or not be able to stop themselves.

We ourselves make the person bad or good, there is no such thing as good or bad, its what works for the society, and ourselves that we measure good and bad.

I feel the same way you do, Losty. There is always an uncontrollable circumstance at hand, and those circumstances prevent me from truly hating anyone. Nevertheless, I still have gut reactions that I can't seem to help at first. And I feel punishment of some kind is in order.

Even though you believe people are good and only do bad things, do you think they should be punished in some way?

(December 2, 2014 at 2:12 am)psychoslice Wrote: We ourselves make the person bad or good, there is no such thing as good or bad, its what works for the society, and ourselves that we measure good and bad.

I think society labels people as bad when they threaten the stability of that society. For example, if a person murders people that would be bad for the community as a whole. So socially speaking that person is bad. But...does that really mean anything beyond them being a threat to their community? Do you think people who rape and murder deserve the same compassion as the sweet old lady who lives next door?

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(December 2, 2014 at 2:19 am)Exian Wrote: I feel the same way you do, Losty. There is always an uncontrollable circumstance at hand, and those circumstances prevent me from truly hating anyone. Nevertheless, I still have gut reactions that I can't seem to help at first. And I feel punishment of some kind is in order.

Even though you believe people are good and only do bad things, do you think they should be punished in some way?

I'm not really sure I am in a position to be punishing anyone or saying anyone deserves to be punished since I am not perfect myself. I think the world would be a much better place if we tried to help these people instead of trying to hurt them. That being said when someone is a danger to others I do believe they should be detained until they are deemed safe.
Also, I have this thing I say to my children. "I am not punishing you. This is a known consequence of your actions", so things like jail time, community service, etc. etc. are acceptable. But...it doesn't mean they're bad people. It probably is more likely to mean they really need some help.

Compassion is also dealt out to those who we believe deserves it, which isn't compassion at all, it all comes back to what we believe deserves compassion, and again society controls that, it all exist because we are here to make it exist, if we weren't here, all this good and bad wouldn't exist at all.

(December 1, 2014 at 9:53 pm)rexbeccarox Wrote: If these people really, truly believe in hell, taking joy out of anyone going there is inherently bad.

I suppose feeling an overwhelming and *thrilling* desire to return fun had at your expense upon those what may or may not have had fun at your expense.... would make you a bad person?

I'd take a lot of joy out of it. I don't feel bad about it, neither.

Well she's bad, bad, Alice cat. Baddest mrurf on the 'hole darn net. Badder than a kick in the dong... meaner than a scratched up wrist! Or... something. Constructive stuff? No way, that is like... work. I'm all worked out. Got dese muscles, ese! Easy. Ooh baby ooh baby look at her go. Where she going nobody knows.

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(December 2, 2014 at 2:48 am)psychoslice Wrote: Compassion is also dealt out to those who we believe deserves it, which isn't compassion at all, it all comes back to what we believe deserves compassion, and again society controls that, it all exist because we are here to make it exist, if we weren't here, all this good and bad wouldn't exist at all.

In the end, it's all a subjective value judgement.

So basically... do bad people exist? Well, do you think they do? If yes, then they do. If no, then they don't to you.

(December 1, 2014 at 11:58 pm)MechViking Wrote: I don't think anyone is bad. Maybe fucked in the head or misguided, but I don't think anyone goes out of their way to do evil. They just do what they think is best for the situation they face.

(December 2, 2014 at 2:07 am)Losty Wrote: That is exactly how I feel. Even people who do horrible evil things must either think it's right or not be able to stop themselves.

(December 2, 2014 at 2:12 am)psychoslice Wrote: We ourselves make the person bad or good, there is no such thing as good or bad, its what works for the society, and ourselves that we measure good and bad.

(December 2, 2014 at 2:19 am)Exian Wrote: I feel the same way you do, Losty. There is always an uncontrollable circumstance at hand, and those circumstances prevent me from truly hating anyone. Nevertheless, I still have gut reactions that I can't seem to help at first. And I feel punishment of some kind is in order.

Even though you believe people are good and only do bad things, do you think they should be punished in some way?

You're over thinking this, people. It's the hat color. White makes you the Lone Ranger, black makes you Darth Vader.