(June 29, 2015 at 3:41 pm)IATIA Wrote:

(June 29, 2015 at 12:02 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I'll be honest and say I'll take being called a bimbo over being compared to the KKK like I was in a different thread. Though more misogynistic, I still think it beats being compare to racist murderers.

I can appreciate that, but you started following along the lines of Randy and that suggested an alignment which got you scooped in with him.  Have you caught up with his postings just before you got here?  I do not know if he truly believes all that or is just trolling, but he does have some scary posts.

Such as the one where he admits Genocide is A-ok with him.  For god...

(June 28, 2015 at 10:08 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(June 28, 2015 at 9:41 am)Chuck Wrote: What did the church do over 300 years to stop it, you coolaid swilling bimbo?

^A man just called me a bimbo for answering someone's question about papal infallibility...

The thing is though, his question has merit: you're arguing for a church that has the ability to speak infallibly and with authority on moral issues, and who apparently is of the opinion that burning heretics is immoral... and yet made no moves to express this infallible truth at the point in time that it would have been useful to do so. The pope, the cardinals, every last person in a position of authority and endowed with this sort of power from god, sat by and watched as the "personal choices" of their subjects led directly to the deaths of others.

They knew it was wrong, but they stood by and let it happen anyway. Is that what Jesus would have done? Was the messiah in the habit of just chilling when he knew people were suffering?

And what does it say, about the supposedly infallible edicts and moral propositions of this organization, when we know, under your own argument, that they are willing to sit back and allow immoral things to happen without a word?

(June 28, 2015 at 10:08 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(June 27, 2015 at 10:19 pm)Brakeman Wrote: How "good" do you consider yourself to be?  How would you describe yourself on a number line from
0= Satan at his worst to 100= Jesus at his best?

Hi Brakeman. That's a difficult qustion to answer. Too difficult to give an exact number, but I'd say probably somewhere in the middle, like the average person.

As I suspected, you admit that you are neither evil not perfectly good, as most, but what keeps you from improving from say, your current 65 to the 99? Honestly, how difficult would it be for you? What would you have to do? What major changes would you have to make in your life?

(June 29, 2015 at 4:58 pm)Esquilax Wrote: They knew it was wrong, but they stood by and let it happen anyway. Is that what Jesus would have done? Was the messiah in the habit of just chilling when he knew people were suffering?

At best you can say, they washed their hands on the issue, since it was the secular authorities doing the actual executions. But Summa Desiderantes paved the way for the belief in witches and they had no problems attending Autodafés in great numbers. There are contemporary drawings of church hierarchs holding the place of honor when a burning took place.

(June 30, 2015 at 8:17 am)abaris Wrote:

(June 29, 2015 at 4:58 pm)Esquilax Wrote: They knew it was wrong, but they stood by and let it happen anyway. Is that what Jesus would have done? Was the messiah in the habit of just chilling when he knew people were suffering?

At best you can say, they washed their hands on the issue, since it was the secular authorities doing the actual executions. But Summa Desiderantes paved the way for the belief in witches and they had no problems attending Autodafés in great numbers. There are contemporary drawings of church hierarchs holding the place of honor when a burning took place.

There is a scripture which is telling.

Quote: Luke 6:43-45New King James Version (NKJV)
A Tree Is Known by Its Fruit
43 “For a good tree does not bear bad fruit, nor does a bad tree bear good fruit. 44 For every tree is known by its own fruit. For men do not gather figs from thorns, nor do they gather grapes from a bramble bush. 45 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart[a] brings forth evil. For out of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaks.

The idea that a otherwise sinful Pope can put forth the good fruit of his biblical pronouncements flies in the face of this verse.

The clergy participated as judges and witnesses and knew full well the effects of their sermons to the people that incited the mob to commit these utterly vile evil acts in the name of religion.

The problem here isn't the world "inherent," but the word "value." Strictly speaking, nothing has "inherent value." Value is completely subjective. What has great value to one being will have little or no value to another; it is the same with life. Some people value animal life above humans. Some value humans more than animals. Some hold them in the same regard. We value our own lives because we wish to survive; we value the lives of others because we are empathetic, social creatures. People who don't place an acceptable value on human life tend to not be valued themselves by human society, so there are obvious, objective advantages to placing value on human life if you plan on living around and dealing with other humans, but the answer to your question is no. Human life does not have inherent value because nothing does. Value is determined by the being who holds it.

OP's ?: Does human life have INHERENT value?

A: If it didn't, ransom wouldn't pay.

(June 29, 2015 at 11:14 am)Chuck Wrote: I like to apologize for my demeaning and uncalled for epithet.   It won't happen again.

Apology accepted, I appreciate it. :-)

(June 30, 2015 at 4:55 pm)whateverist Wrote: OP's ?: Does human life have INHERENT value?

A:  If it didn't, ransom wouldn't pay.

No, ransom pays (if and when it does) because that particular life has value to the person paying the ransom, and that level of value is so high as to basically be priceless. Another person might not pay that ransom (even if they had it) because they don't value the life enough to part with the money. Ransom, furthermore, is different in each hostage situation. The value varies even to the people demanding the ransom. Ransom is not an example of inherent value.

(June 30, 2015 at 7:56 am)Brakeman Wrote:

(June 28, 2015 at 10:08 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Hi Brakeman. That's a difficult qustion to answer. Too difficult to give an exact number, but I'd say probably somewhere in the middle, like the average person.

As I suspected, you admit that you are neither evil not perfectly good, as most, but what keeps you from improving from say, your current 65  to the 99?  Honestly, how difficult would it be for you? What would you have to do? What major changes would you have to make in your life?

I have a bad habit of lashing out at my husband or other family members for things that are not their fault. I can be terribly impatient in most situations. Sometimes I get caught up in materialistic things and I buy the expensive clothes/etc rather than giving more to charity, for example.

Those are probably the main things I could improve on. :-)

May I ask what you would rank yourself? And what you think you need to improve on?

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(June 29, 2015 at 4:51 pm)Spooky Wrote:

(June 29, 2015 at 3:41 pm)IATIA Wrote: I can appreciate that, but you started following along the lines of Randy and that suggested an alignment which got you scooped in with him.  Have you caught up with his postings just before you got here?  I do not know if he truly believes all that or is just trolling, but he does have some scary posts.

Such as the one where he admits Genocide is A-ok with him.  For god...

I highly doubt Randy believes genocide is ok. It's against Church teaching to kill anyone unless it's for self defense or in a just war (strict conditions apply), so I really don't think he'd be for it.

Perhaps what he meant was not very well understood?