My views on objective morality

[Catholic_Lady]

The analogy had nothing to do with power, it's about letting a person suffer so they learn. There were times when your parents did this even when it was completely in their power to stop you from making a mistake. That doesn't make them "cunts", it makes them good parents.

Your parents are doing this because they ultimately see it as being in your best interest, and they, being your parents, have both the liberty and the duty to decide for you in those cases.  Not so with God.  I am not God's child and his interests are not my own.

He's presenting the Christian position though. The Christian position is that God created us, is our Father, and is looking out for our best interest.

[abaris]

The Christian position is that God created us, is our Father, and is looking out for our best interest.

But there's not even an agreement there between christians. This can be an abusive father, who provided nothing but your existence, some punches and eternal torture threats to go with that, in order to make you fear him. Or it may be a caring and forgiving parent. And every kind of shade in between.

It all depends on perspective and what your environment made you believe. When I was little, as I said, before they reduced the OT to an allegory, I disliked the old guy, but still liked Jesus. I didn't associate the two, but when I was old enough to do it was the moment to question the whole narrative.

[Tiberius]

Your parents are doing this because they ultimately see it as being in your best interest, and they, being your parents, have both the liberty and the duty to decide for you in those cases. Not so with God. I am not God's child and his interests are not my own.

According to Christian doctrine, you are God's child and he is very much concerned about your interests. That's why the analogy works.

[Catholic_Lady]

The Christian position is that God created us, is our Father, and is looking out for our best interest.

But there's not even an agreement there between christians. This can be an abusive father, who provided nothing but your existence, some punches and eternal torture threats to go with that, in order to make you fear him. Or it may be a caring and forgiving parent. And every kind of shade in between.

It all depends on perspective and what your environment made you believe. When I was little, as I said, before they reduced the OT to an allegory, I disliked the old guy, but still liked Jesus. I didn't associate the two, but when I was old enough to do it was the moment to question the whole narrative.

Really? Those 3 things I listed are pretty fundamental Christian beliefs about God. I guess to some Christians "looking out for our best interest" means being super duper harsh and cold, but in their minds God is still doing that for our own good.

[abaris]

I guess to some Christians "looking out for our best interest" means being super duper harsh and cold, but in their minds God is still doing that for our own good.

As says the father beating up his kids on a regular basis. And yes, there are such christians. Even Randy didn't have as benign a god image as you do. But by his own admission he converted and didn't grow up as a catholic either.

[bennyboy]

Your parents are doing this because they ultimately see it as being in your best interest, and they, being your parents, have both the liberty and the duty to decide for you in those cases.  Not so with God.  I am not God's child and his interests are not my own.

According to Christian doctrine, you are God's child and he is very much concerned about your interests. That's why the analogy works.

Here's another analogy.  God has given a child a butterknife, pointed out an electrical socket, and said, "Don't put that knife in that hole."  But then, because he loves the child so much, he doesn't bother covering it or stopping the kid when he's about to put the knife in the socket, because-- you know-- the kid has to be free to act on his own.

But the difference between God and any other parent is that after the kid sticks the knife in the socket and dies, God will burn him in hellfire for all eternity, cuz if you don't torture him forever and ever until the end of time, he won't learn nuthin'.

Yep. Sounds pretty moral to me.

[Whateverist]

Way to cling to the very worst parts of fundamentalism.

Are there any good parts of fundamentalism?

No.  Just bad parts and worse parts.

[bennyboy]

Your parents are doing this because they ultimately see it as being in your best interest, and they, being your parents, have both the liberty and the duty to decide for you in those cases.  Not so with God.  I am not God's child and his interests are not my own.

He's presenting the Christian position though. The Christian position is that God created us, is our Father, and is looking out for our best interest.

. . . and will burn us in fire for all eternity if we do anything He doesn't like.  You keep forgetting to include that part.

[abaris]

. . . and will burn us in fire for all eternity if we do anything He doesn't like.  You keep forgetting to include that part.

Catholics don't subscribe to the burning part anymore. When I was little, they still did. But as far as I understand it, catholics subsicribe to the absence of god as punishment today. CL might correct me, if I'm wrong.

[Whateverist]

But most of this harsh stuff is from the fundamentalist protestant wing of the Christian family. The Catholic church isn't wed to the bible in the same way. Doesn't mean it isn't ever deserving of criticism. But since every adult is entitled to their own opinion on such matters there is no call to be overbearing about it. No one has authority over what anyone else may believe. If anyone cares about changing minds, they will do better to give and earn respect.