I'm not afraid of terrorism, are you?

[henryp]

It's an interesting question of how much risk is an okay amount of risk.  And then the secondary question of how much risk is okay to subject other people to.  I don't mind you picking up hitchhikers, because you're assuming all the risk. 

A hypothetical:  If there are 10k syrian refugees.  And exactly 1 of them will attempt a terrorist attack, do you let them in?  It's statistically unlikely any individual american will be harmed by the 1 attack, but that will be little consolation to the 3 people who get killed.  It's a tough balance to strike because there is no way for you to assume all the risk like there is in hitchhiking.

It's actually a very good comparison. Picking up hitchhikers is very safe after all, they are in your car which you are driving and like with the refugees, you can talk to the hitchhikers first and don't have to let them into your car and if you do you can keep track of them. That's how we can vet the refugees in a way the Europe cannot. Also this is a situation that we played a part in creating. How could we as Americans not do something to help?

Also, I'm not afraid of picking up hitchhikers and I'm not afraid of terrorism. I'm not going to live my life as though some worst case scenario is around the corner and I think that's a shitty way for a country to act too.

A gun would probably complicate the 'your car' safety bubble. 

I have become more risk averse due to having a young child.  When she's 18, I'll likely worry about dying less.  But I feel a ton of pressure not to die for the next 10-15 years.  Like I said, I'm cool with you picking up hitchhikers.  But if I was in your car, I'd complain.  If I were in the car with my kid, I'd throw a hissy fit that would scare away the hitchhiker.

[The Grand Nudger]

If somebody climbs in the american car....regardless of whether or not they have bad intentions - there's a distinct chance that we're going to shoot them, lol. 

[henryp]

Those attacks -aren't- associated with -refugees- except by those who do not wish to see those refugees reach their shores because...and I can't help but call it like I see it "they're gonna steal our stuff yall!".  

I blame it on jihadi salafists.  You know...the -terrorists-....and their unintentional/hapless compatriots......the people who keep insinuating or just outright calling refugees terrorists.

I don't want anyone from this forum to babysit my kid, because they might be a child molester.  I don't think anyone on this forum is a child molester.  

I'm not concerned with people on this forum because they are on this forum.  I'm concerned because of circumstances associated with being on this forum.  In this case, you're all strangers to me.

It is not that the people are refugees.  It is the circumstances related to their being refugees in that region.  If you can remove the problems, such as making sure they aren't a part of a terrorist organization, that makes it better.  But I'm still not crazy about the culture.  You say a few loons.  But anecdotally, it feels like more than a few lately.

[The Grand Nudger]

Presentment....that might have to do with the people who you're listening to, to have reached this conclusion in the first place.  Say, the Trumpster and friends? Couple billion muslims wordwide, a few jihadis fly off the handle....and you bring down the ire on -refugees- for it.  Am I missing something? That's three different groups of people there. United by a loosely common faith -perhaps-...but still distinct from each other.

I can't repeat it enough, I think you're a good guy, wallym, I'm not commenting on you personally (bet you wouldn't molest my kids)....I think you've been had.

[henryp]

Presentment effect...that might have to do with the people who you're listening to, to have reached this conclusion in the first place.  Say, the Trumpster and friends?  Couple billion muslims wordwide, a few fly off the handle....and you bring down the ire on -refugees- for it.  Am I missing something?

I can't repeat it enough, I think you're a good guy, wallym, I'm not commenting on you personally (bet you wouldn't molest my kids)....I think you've been had.

Maybe it's the presentment effect.  I got a good laugh yesterday, as on the sidebar of the CNN front page was "Obama: Trump doom and gloom doesn't reflect reality"  And the main headline was 12 KILLED IN MASS SHOOTING IN GERMANY!

[The Grand Nudger]

Maybe that's because -Little Girl Decides: "He does, indeed, love me"after harrowing experience with local wildflower- won't hit the network metrics? 

I don't think it's worth my time to comment on the relationship between trumps stump and reality. You could google that one yourself. I''ll just say that it was impressive, I appreciate that sort of thing.

[Thumpalumpacus]

We're going in circles.  I get what you are saying.  I think it's just a tough sell given the rate of attacks around the world associated with refugees/islam/countries in the middle east/whatever demographic you want to blame it on.

Compare those numbers, then, to the number of mass-murders that have occurred in America over a similar time-scale ... and look at the murderers and their backgrounds.

I'm fine with refugees and think America has an obligation to take in more. We are, after all, the ones who fucked the situation up in the first place.

[Thumpalumpacus]

A gun would probably complicate the 'your car' safety bubble.

I'm not sure it'd be a good idea to shoot someone who is, you know, driving you around at 60 mph.

Your, ahem, mileage may vary.

[CapnAwesome]

It's actually a very good comparison. Picking up hitchhikers is very safe after all, they are in your car which you are driving and like with the refugees, you can talk to the hitchhikers first and don't have to let them into your car and if you do you can keep track of them. That's how we can vet the refugees in a way the Europe cannot. Also this is a situation that we played a part in creating. How could we as Americans not do something to help?

Also, I'm not afraid of picking up hitchhikers and I'm not afraid of terrorism. I'm not going to live my life as though some worst case scenario is around the corner and I think that's a shitty way for a country to act too.

A gun would probably complicate the 'your car' safety bubble. 

I have become more risk averse due to having a young child.  When she's 18, I'll likely worry about dying less.  But I feel a ton of pressure not to die for the next 10-15 years.  Like I said, I'm cool with you picking up hitchhikers.  But if I was in your car, I'd complain.  If I were in the car with my kid, I'd throw a hissy fit that would scare away the hitchhiker.

How risk adverse can you get? There is also a difference between perceived risk and actual risk. Your risk of dying from terrorism rounds down to 0. Your risk is better of dying of literally anything else. Same goes for picking up hitchhikers, doubly so. I'd be skeptical that even a single person has died from a hitchhiker related murder this year. So there is a point where you can't buy into what you are commonly told.

Edit: Actually there was a lone study done in the 1970s on crime and hitchhiking, which came to the conclusion that picking up a hitchhiker is no more dangerous then any other contact with any other person and that hitchhiking was also no more likely to make you a victim of a crime then say, walking down a random street. During that year, 1974, there was 0 hitchhiking related murders and I'd be shocked if there were any today. Like with terrorism, there is just a disconnect between reality and what we are told by the media.

https://wandrlymagazine.com/article/hitchhiking/

[CapnAwesome]

A gun would probably complicate the 'your car' safety bubble.

I'm not sure it'd be a good idea to shoot someone who is, you know, driving you around at 60 mph.

Your, ahem, mileage may vary.

Exactly, it's probably the safest situation you could be in to have a gun pointed at you. Besides, a hitchhiker who is robbing or shooting people is going to be caught almost immediately so if the person has any self interest they are not going to rob or shoot someone while hitchhiking. Also there is just no real data that backs up the idea that hitchhikers are more likely to rob or rape then anyone else. The lone study done on it reported 0 murders and 0 rapes done by hitchhikers in 1974.

https://wandrlymagazine.com/article/hitchhiking/

Again, this relates to the refugees, because the media perception of the risk just doesn't equal the reality of the situation. Yes, there have been a few incidents involving refugees in Germany, but they have also taken in millions of refugees. Is their incidents of murder any higher then the general populace? I'd be skeptical. The main problem with them is going to be adjusting millions of people to German culture, eliminating Islamic attitudes towards women, etc etc. That's a problem with Islam in general though, regardless of what country they are in. I don't think the US would really have the problem with refugees, because historically we've been far better at integrating immigrants then Europe and we are just taking in so many less of them. The risk is negligible.