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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:31 pm
(July 21, 2015 at 1:31 pm)Minimalist Wrote: "God" is not an evil fucker. God doesn't exist. The primitive fuckheads who invented him were evil fuckers.
They may indeed be malevolent. Or incompetent.
Much like Epicurus's riddle. Similar applies to the goat herders who wrote the holy babble. Indeed.
The only real relevant difference is that Epicurus's riddle is with regards to what God is if he were to exist.
Assuming God does not exist... he is certainly not malevolent (or evil). Nor is he incompetent. I wouldn't really define non-existence as incompetent. It would be meaningless to say that God, fairies, elves and ghosts are incompetent merely because such things do not exist outside our imaginations (God is imaginary, unreal, existent only like superman is existent as a 'character').
But assuming the goat herders who wrote the holy babble, whoever they were, assuming that whoever wrote the holy babble wrote the holy babble (don't bother reading Holy Babble ™... anyone... it's full of Yahweh, Jesus and other wacky shit).................. they may have been evil (or malevolent).... but they may have been incompetent. Which includes deluded, clueless, ignorant, stupid, mad, insane, etc.
Unless by 'evil' you include the impersonal definition of evil. I.e. natural disasters 'are an evil': in the sense that they're bad.
If by 'evil', you are also including that definition. Then yes, the goat herders who wrote the holy babble were necessarily evil at least in that sense.
Thank you.
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:32 pm
(September 12, 2017 at 8:24 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: (September 12, 2017 at 8:15 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: All that has been done is a bunch of speculation without having examined the evidence yourself. I forget which part of the scientific method that is...
Lol, Huggy. Tell us, which part of the scientific method did you use to determine that the light in your picture is the Holy Spirit?
You didn't see the report of the scientific testing that was done to the negative?
It was the examiners own personal opinion that the light was supernatural, in other words THERE WAS NO EXPLANATION SCIENTIFIC OR OTHERWISE FOR WHY THE LIGHT WAS THERE.
What you guys have is SPECULATION based on nothing other than the opinion that the supernatural cannot exist...
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:39 pm
(This post was last modified: September 12, 2017 at 8:41 pm by LadyForCamus.)
(September 12, 2017 at 8:32 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: (September 12, 2017 at 8:24 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: Lol, Huggy. Tell us, which part of the scientific method did you use to determine that the light in your picture is the Holy Spirit?
You didn't see the report of the scientific testing that was done to the negative?
It was the examiners own personal opinion that the light was supernatural, in other words THERE WAS NO EXPLANATION SCIENTIFIC OR OTHERWISE FOR WHY THE LIGHT WAS THERE.
What you guys have is SPECULATION based on nothing other than the opinion that the supernatural cannot exist...
He said no such thing. He said, and I quote (bold mine):
"Based upon the above described examination and study I am of the definite opinion that the negative submitted for examination, was not retouched nor was it a composite or double exposed negative.
Further, I am of the definite opinion that the light streak appearing above the head in a halo position was caused by the light striking the negative."
In other words, he said it was light.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”
Wiser words were never spoken.
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:40 pm
(This post was last modified: September 12, 2017 at 8:42 pm by Amarok.)
Quote:You didn't see the report of the scientific testing that was done to the negative?
Yes and it does not support you conclusion
Quote:It was the examiners own personal opinion that the light was supernatural, in other words THERE WAS NO EXPLANATION SCIENTIFIC OR OTHERWISE FOR WHY THE LIGHT WAS THERE
No it was not his opinion that it was supernatural . Accept all the explanation we have presented
Quote:What you guys have is SPECULATION based on nothing other than the opinion that the supernatural cannot exist...
Nope shit we know exists and causes similar effects . And no evidence of the supernatural nature has been presented.
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:41 pm
(This post was last modified: September 12, 2017 at 8:47 pm by Simon Moon.)
(September 12, 2017 at 8:32 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: (September 12, 2017 at 8:24 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: Lol, Huggy. Tell us, which part of the scientific method did you use to determine that the light in your picture is the Holy Spirit?
You didn't see the report of the scientific testing that was done to the negative?
It was the examiners own personal opinion that the light was supernatural, in other words THERE WAS NO EXPLANATION SCIENTIFIC OR OTHERWISE FOR WHY THE LIGHT WAS THERE.
What you guys have is SPECULATION based on nothing other than the opinion that the supernatural cannot exist...
So, scientific reports demonstrate that the photo is legit. So what?
All that shows is that the photo wasn't tampered with.
As LadyOfCamus said, which part of the scientific method gets from an untampered photo, to "my god is responsible"?
Quote:It was the examiners own personal opinion that the light was supernatural, in other words THERE WAS NO EXPLANATION SCIENTIFIC OR OTHERWISE FOR WHY THE LIGHT WAS THERE.
Seriously?!
Since when does, "THERE WAS NO EXPLANATION SCIENTIFIC OR OTHERWISE FOR WHY THE LIGHT WAS THERE" lead to an explanation?
You are actually saying, "there is no explanation, therefore, there is an explanation. And the only possible explanation is magic".
This is classic argument from ignorance.
Why not just stop at, "there is no explanation"? Then continue with, "I wonder how we can find out the actual explanation?". That is actually the scientific method.
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:43 pm
(This post was last modified: September 12, 2017 at 8:44 pm by Huggy Bear.)
It's amazing the amount of mental gymnastics you guys perform when faced with scientific evidence that doesn't support your world view..
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:46 pm
(September 12, 2017 at 8:43 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:
It's amazing the amount of mental gymnastics you guys perform when faced with scientific evidence that doesn't support your world view..
Ah...
So now, critical thinking, requiring good evidence, the scientific method, and rational thinking, is mental gymnastics?
Just what do you have scientific evidence for?
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:54 pm
(This post was last modified: September 12, 2017 at 9:02 pm by Amarok.)
Quote:It's amazing the amount of mental gymnastics you guys perform when faced with scientific evidence that doesn't support your world view..
No it's more amazing your still insisting science supports your nonsense. And the gymnastics you use to come to the conclusion Magic!
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 8:56 pm
(This post was last modified: September 12, 2017 at 8:57 pm by Simon Moon.)
(September 12, 2017 at 8:39 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: (September 12, 2017 at 8:32 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: You didn't see the report of the scientific testing that was done to the negative?
It was the examiners own personal opinion that the light was supernatural, in other words THERE WAS NO EXPLANATION SCIENTIFIC OR OTHERWISE FOR WHY THE LIGHT WAS THERE.
What you guys have is SPECULATION based on nothing other than the opinion that the supernatural cannot exist...
He said no such thing. He said, and I quote (bold mine):
"Based upon the above described examination and study I am of the definite opinion that the negative submitted for examination, was not retouched nor was it a composite or double exposed negative.
Further, I am of the definite opinion that the light streak appearing above the head in a halo position was caused by the light striking the negative."
In other words, he said it was light.
Huggy lying?!
No! Tell me it ain't so...
No Christian has ever lied for Jesus. 
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
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RE: Is Accepting Christian Evidence Special Pleading?
September 12, 2017 at 9:02 pm
(September 12, 2017 at 8:43 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:
It's amazing the amount of mental gymnastics you guys perform when faced with scientific evidence that doesn't support your world view..
What "world view" is that exactly? Rational skepticism?
I'll ask you again. Since your own scientific source determined only that the cause of image was light, how did you reach the conclusion that the source of the light was the Holy Spirit? I find it highly more probable that the light was caused by something natural rather than supernatural, because I know of many, many sources of natural light that actually exist. This shouldn't be so hard, Hugz.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”
Wiser words were never spoken.
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