Posts: 19789
Threads: 57
Joined: September 24, 2010
Reputation:
85
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
September 29, 2017 at 4:08 pm
(This post was last modified: September 29, 2017 at 4:10 pm by Anomalocaris.)
(July 27, 2017 at 4:03 pm)Lutrinae Wrote: By any logical standard if there was any evidence for the existence of god, that would make faith irrelevant.
That faith is needed in the religious community reasonably means that zero evidence is in existence to prove god is real.
Well, because the miracle of Christianity is it can hoodwink people into believing that which require faith to see and interpret is nonetheless evidence.
Posts: 2435
Threads: 21
Joined: May 5, 2017
Reputation:
26
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
September 29, 2017 at 4:25 pm
Atheist73
Quote:Faith is just a fancy word for magical thinking/make believe. Ask any christian how jesus, when he was taken up into the clouds, how did he breathe oxygen when he was so high up?
With our Lord God ALL THINGS are Possible.
Quote:How did he get through earth's atmosphere without being burned to death?
See above.
Quote:Once in space, how did he breath and how did he get back to sky disneyland?
See above x3
Quote:It takes faith to believe this crap because nothing the bible purports that faith can accomplish...can actually be accomplished in reality.
How familiar are you with the Holy Bible? The Word Of Our God?
It's amazing 'science' always seems to 'find' whatever it is funded for, and never the oppsite. Drich.
Posts: 30129
Threads: 304
Joined: April 18, 2014
Reputation:
92
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
September 29, 2017 at 5:05 pm
"Faith" contrasted with "evidence" should be quite a relief for the vast majority of Christians. If their church hierarchy actually knew instead of believed imagine the draconian efforts they would put into administering their faith lest God vomit them out of the earth!!! And even a pew warmer screwing up something like menstruating in the sanctuary or failing to murder a disobedient child would guaranty a literal rain of fire on the entire congregation !!!
Or GASP (!!!) having a flower pot with 2 different kinds of flowers in it !!!!
OMG !!!!!!!!! 
The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it.
Posts: 22
Threads: 1
Joined: September 24, 2017
Reputation:
4
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
September 30, 2017 at 2:06 am
Really interesting question. It would seem all belief systems require faith of some description, that in itself demonstrates that faith is simply throwing your lot in with a system of belief that best suits who you are, where you were born etc. Most theists (and I'm one at this stage in my life's journey) look at the complexity of the natural world and see a deities handy work. But that is not proof of a deity as many other people (agnostics, many scientists, atheists and so on) look at the same evidence and have a naturalistic argument that satisfies their inquiry, and I wouldn't necessarily call that faith though many theists mislabel it as such. When it comes to drawing conclusions about abiogenesis I guess we either rely on faith or simply state 'I don't know'. So, is there enough evidence to accept that there is God without having faith. The obvious (to my way of thinking) answer is no. If God suddenly appeared, none of us would need faith. So why is faith required? Because of lack of conclusive evidence.
Posts: 5466
Threads: 36
Joined: November 10, 2014
Reputation:
53
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
September 30, 2017 at 12:43 pm
(September 30, 2017 at 2:06 am)beepete Wrote: Really interesting question. It would seem all belief systems require faith of some description, that in itself demonstrates that faith is simply throwing your lot in with a system of belief that best suits who you are, where you were born etc. Most theists (and I'm one at this stage in my life's journey) look at the complexity of the natural world and see a deities handy work. But that is not proof of a deity as many other people (agnostics, many scientists, atheists and so on) look at the same evidence and have a naturalistic argument that satisfies their inquiry, and I wouldn't necessarily call that faith though many theists mislabel it as such. When it comes to drawing conclusions about abiogenesis I guess we either rely on faith or simply state 'I don't know'. So, is there enough evidence to accept that there is God without having faith. The obvious (to my way of thinking) answer is no. If God suddenly appeared, none of us would need faith. So why is faith required? Because of lack of conclusive evidence.
If there's a lack of conclusive evidence, then why presume a god?
Posts: 38
Threads: 1
Joined: October 3, 2017
Reputation:
0
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
October 3, 2017 at 4:04 pm
(This post was last modified: October 6, 2017 at 5:33 pm by Losty.)
(July 27, 2017 at 4:03 pm)Lutrinae Wrote: By any logical standard if there was any evidence for the existence of god, that would make faith irrelevant.
That faith is needed in the religious community reasonably means that zero evidence is in existence to prove god is real.
The leap in logic you made here is VERY perplexing, but I'll answer the original question answered in your thread: faith is more than just belief. There is proof for God's existence in abundance, oh yes, but with all that said, believing in the existence of a God is not what salvation is about. Salvation is about life-transforming faith in the God of the universe (Romans 10:9), belief He is as holy as He says He is, and entering into right relationship with Him from which great works stem. But the faith is the foundation, and you can only have faith in the existence of God by believing He exists, which is only really the beginning of any relationship (think about it, I can't hae a relationship with a person whom I don't believe exists).
I think you and others on this forum would benefit from my YouTube channel. My most recent video was on the tragedy of the Vegas shooting the other night, but if you want, you can just tart with my intro video to get a sense of who I am in all this:
Moderator Notice
link removed for violation of 30/30 rule
Posts: 38
Threads: 1
Joined: October 3, 2017
Reputation:
0
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
October 7, 2017 at 12:23 pm
There is evidence - look at the universe. Look at life - how could this have happened by chance? From there, it's just a matter of what deity makes best sense, and from there, the Bible provides a lot of evidence (yup, your forums have been invaded by a Christian - I was once an atheist so I get it). I guess, ask me about it - I'll try and respond, but I'm not sure how to turn on notifications for this site.
Posts: 67201
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
162
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
October 7, 2017 at 12:45 pm
(October 7, 2017 at 12:23 pm)speedyj1992 Wrote: There is evidence - look at the universe. Look at life - how could this have happened by chance? From there, it's just a matter of what deity makes best sense, and from there, the Bible provides a lot of evidence (yup, your forums have been invaded by a Christian - I was once an atheist so I get it). I guess, ask me about it - I'll try and respond, but I'm not sure how to turn on notifications for this site.
By chance or by god probably isn't an exhaustive list of options. If you're pointing to magic book, we're already in faith territory.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 7568
Threads: 20
Joined: July 26, 2013
Reputation:
54
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
October 7, 2017 at 2:24 pm
(This post was last modified: October 7, 2017 at 2:26 pm by Crossless2.0.)
speedyj1992 Wrote:yup, your forums have been invaded by a Christian - I was once an atheist so I get it
I doubt that you get it at all. If you did, you’d have been ashamed to have written the nonsense that constitutes the rest of the post from which I quoted.
Can’t wait to see you regurgitate the usual apologist talking points.
Posts: 5466
Threads: 36
Joined: November 10, 2014
Reputation:
53
RE: If evidence for god is in abundance, why is faith necessary?
October 7, 2017 at 4:08 pm
(October 7, 2017 at 12:23 pm)speedyj1992 Wrote: There is evidence - look at the universe. Look at life - how could this have happened by chance? From there, it's just a matter of what deity makes best sense, and from there, the Bible provides a lot of evidence (yup, your forums have been invaded by a Christian - I was once an atheist so I get it). I guess, ask me about it - I'll try and respond, but I'm not sure how to turn on notifications for this site.
Argument from incredulity stemming from personal ignorance is a logical fallacy.
"I don't know how this could've happened! It must've been a miracle!" Nope.
|
