Actual Infinity in Reality?

[Angrboda]

[possibletarian]

Give the guy a break, It is (well was) the weekend. He may simply be spending time family side.

Meanwhile, here's some music.. (scratched patchy version of the four seasons plays)

your call is very important to us you are number (different voice)5672 in the queue you call will be answered in (different voice)5 days

(scratched patchy version of the four seasons plays again) ...........

[Sal]

I just read your opening post. I don't know what has been presented.

You ask if something can exist "something concrete (not abstract)". -edit- that is infinite.

The theory of a Black-hole is just that. Is there an end to how dense a singularity can get? No. Theoretically it can continue to be more and more dense. At infinitude. There is nothing more "concrete" then matter its self. A black-hole is that mater condensed and can theoretically continue to condense more and more.

If you mean something that is proven beyond theory, then the idea of numbers. One can always count higher. There is no end to numbers. Count and count and count on. You'll always have another number to go to.

Is a singularity very dense matter? Yes.

Infinite? I don't think so.

[downbeatplumb]

I just read your opening post. I don't know what has been presented.

You ask if something can exist "something concrete (not abstract)". -edit- that is infinite.

The theory of a Black-hole is just that. Is there an end to how dense a singularity can get? No. Theoretically it can continue to be more and more dense. At infinitude. There is nothing more "concrete" then matter its self. A black-hole is that mater condensed and can theoretically continue to condense more and more.

If you mean something that is proven beyond theory, then the idea of numbers. One can always count higher. There is no end to numbers. Count and count and count on. You'll always have another number to go to.

Is a singularity very dense matter? Yes.

Infinite? I don't think so.

I heard a physicist say that when they get to having to put infinities in they know theres something wrong with the maths somewhere.

[pocaracas]

Is a singularity very dense matter? Yes.

Infinite? I don't think so.

I'd rephrase that:

Is a black hole very dense matter? Yes.

Infinite? I don't think so.

The singularity happens when the maths go towards infinity.

Black holes need not be singularities.

[GrandizerII]

I just read your opening post. I don't know what has been presented.

You ask if something can exist "something concrete (not abstract)". -edit- that is infinite.

The theory of a Black-hole is just that. Is there an end to how dense a singularity can get? No. Theoretically it can continue to be more and more dense. At infinitude. There is nothing more "concrete" then matter its self. A black-hole is that mater condensed and can theoretically continue to condense more and more.

If you mean something that is proven beyond theory, then the idea of numbers. One can always count higher. There is no end to numbers. Count and count and count on. You'll always have another number to go to.

Is a singularity very dense matter? Yes.

Infinite? I don't think so.

The singularity is an assumption, not a scientific fact. The Big Bang theory is to do with the expansion rather than the beginning of the existence of this universe.

[Sal]

Well, to be fair, there's nothing known about black holes beyond the event horizon.

[polymath257]

Is a singularity very dense matter? Yes.

Infinite? I don't think so.

The singularity is an assumption, not a scientific fact. The Big Bang theory is to do with the expansion rather than the beginning of the existence of this universe.

And the singularity of General Relativity in this situation tends to be 'smoothed out' when quantum considerations are taken into account.

Of course, those same quantum descriptions then have infinite time (which is not nearly the problem that infinite density is).

[GrandizerII]

Well, to be fair, there's nothing known about black holes beyond the event horizon.

Theres nothing known about what happened before the Big Bang either. There is nothing in the laws suggesting that the universe or wider cosmos can only be finite in space or time or divisibility.

[Anomalocaris]

Is a singularity very dense matter? Yes.

Infinite? I don't think so.

I heard a physicist say that when they get to having to put infinities in they know theres something wrong with the maths somewhere.

Not exactly so.

Physicist are also susceptible to brash talk. The difference is behind the brash outward talk, the ethos of the entire physics community is the willingness to do the ground work and take the time to verify or refute the talk using a consistent framework. It could well be that in 50 years, physicists of the future look back at the present and laugh at gutlessness or false confidence of the current generation of physicist in their refusal to continence infinity as a proper solution.

When physicists say they know, in here they mean they strongly suspect there is something wrong because infinity correlates to no clearly known analogue in realty, and can not as yet form any the basis for further predictive mathematical manipulation.

They strongly suspect the solution to the practical problem of what to do with the seeming mathematical dead end much more likely lies with discovering any errors or insufficiently accurate approximations in the road map leading to the mathematical dead end,  then in finding a further path from that seeming dead end onwards.