"Twelve" in the Quran.

[Angrboda]

More Shia nonsense. "Blah, blah, blah, blah...."

[Mystic]

At work.

I must admit to being confused over the supposed importance of some rather arbitrary symbols...

I mean, what is so frangipani-tastic about XII anyway?

After the founder, some people will rebel. Some people will follow false claims of authority or down-play it and replace the true authority with the false idol that is chosen by humans.

Aside from that, some people will acknowledge the chosen ones, but then follow wrong people claiming that. 

So there had to be, clarification to the number of successors, but in a subtle way that lets the rebellious ignore it and not make their own twelve, while it remaining clear in the lovers of God's beautiful names, exactly the number and who the Prophet named per that number and there is no list of names from the Prophet of twelve aside from these, and there is no list of Imams pre-told by names except these Imams.

Now this would be true of ALL nations with a founding Messenger, so there has to be clarification, and Quran argues so that it remains absolute clear in all ages, God has been consistent with this number from the start and with the Israelites as well with the covenant of Moses, and so it clarifies the number of Ulil-Amr after the Messenger.

[Minimalist]

This is spamming.

It's preaching.

It's bullshit.

[GrandizerII]

At work.

I must admit to being confused over the supposed importance of some rather arbitrary symbols...

I mean, what is so frangipani-tastic about XII anyway?

Exactly what I was thinking.

MK, what point is there in trying to convince us that "12" means a particular thing? You're not getting me (and I'm pretty sure most atheists) any step closer to accepting the truth of the Quran. In fact, I honestly don't think there's anything you can do to convince us the Quran was handed down by God. Most of us are absolutely sure that it could not have been authored by Allah. The "best" you can do is pray for Allah to show himself clearly to us all (and that's not something we think will ever happen at all, so perhaps don't even bother). And even if we were all eventually convinced Allah existed, there's still that hurdle of your Allah not being desirable enough to be worshiped.

So don't count on your human limits to do anything. You're special (I'm sure), but you're not that special. You're just a human being, like us all.

[Minimalist]

Fuck islam.

If Muslims recognized the number "Twelve" and it's emphasis in the Quran - the world would not be in the state it is, but rather, peace and justice, most probably would have long been established.

All I want to know is why can't muslims recognize that atheists do not give a flying fuck about them, their prophet, their god and their fucking big book of horseshit?

[Deesse23]

[Peebothuhlu]

At work.

I must admit to being confused over the supposed importance of some rather arbitrary symbols...

I mean, what is so frangipani-tastic about XII anyway?

After the founder, some people will rebel. Some people will follow false claims of authority or down-play it and replace the true authority with the false idol that is chosen by humans.

Aside from that, some people will acknowledge the chosen ones, but then follow wrong people claiming that. 

So there had to be, clarification to the number of successors, but in a subtle way that lets the rebellious ignore it and not make their own twelve, while it remaining clear in the lovers of God's beautiful names, exactly the number and who the Prophet named per that number and there is no list of names from the Prophet of twelve aside from these, and there is no list of Imams pre-told by names except these Imams.

Now this would be true of ALL nations with a founding Messenger, so there has to be clarification, and Quran argues so that it remains absolute clear in all ages, God has been consistent with this number from the start and with the Israelites as well with the covenant of Moses, and so it clarifies the number of Ulil-Amr after the Messenger.

Why should I care about any 'Founders'?

Why should I care about other people's myths and fables?

Other than, perhapse, for the interest in comparing and contrasting with the fables of others?

The evolution between the writings in the Hobbit to the Lord of the rings is still captivating to myself.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

It's preaching.

It's bullshit.

[Angrboda]

Twelver (Arabic: اثنا عشرية‎, translit. Athnā‘ashariyyah or Ithnā‘ashariyyah; Persian: شیعه دوازده‌امامی‎, pronounced [ʃiːʔe-je dævɑzdæh emɑmiː]) or Imamiyyah (Arabic: إمامية‎) is the largest branch of Shia Islam. The term Twelver refers to its adherents' belief in twelve divinely ordained leaders, known as the Twelve Imams, and their belief that the last Imam, Muhammad al-Mahdi, lives in occultation and will reappear as the promised Mahdi.

Twelver

[Minimalist]

and will reappear as the promised Mahdi.

Is he racing jesus to get back?

Seems like a slug racing a glacier!