Sin, I don't believe in Sin.

[Kayenneh]

Damn Tempus, you beat me to it. That would have been my next post on this thread XD

[genkaus]

Sin, as always, is anything that's in violation of god's written word. You believe in god, you believe in sin.

The question here is ... do you believe in sin if you do not believe in god and if so, why??

Is it violation of god's written word or that of written word supposedly coming from god?

For example, I'm willing to accept the definition of sin as "anything that goes against instructions of the bible". I'd say, okay, fine, by that definition, I'm very much a sinner. Its not like that's a bad thing.

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If sin(s) do not exist how do you account for murder, rape etc. You are right in connecting sin with religion, and Christianity in particular. The bible tells us that sin/rebellion seperates us from God. It started in the Garden of Eden with Adam and Eve and has continued ever since.

Although sin/rebellion seperates us from God, He has offered us a solution through Jesus Christ His Son the only Saviour, for all who trust in Him and all that He achieved on the Cross of Calvary.

God's offer of reconcilliation and the consequences for refusing this is clearly spelt out in the following passage from The Bible;

Jn 3: 16 - 18 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son."

I am happy to discuss this further, providing it doesn't become a bun fight.

Your god's offer is not made in good faith or on equal terms and hence is rejected unconditionally. His attempt at forcing acceptance by apriori payment is also rejected and is, frankly, a little revolting. Therefore, there is no need for any further discussion of the terms.

[Zen Badger]

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Every now and then I find it so hard to suspend my disbelief that I have to ask, do you actually believe everything that you have just written? I mean really believe that it is a 100% accurate statement of historical reality and literally happened?

It is not my intention to ridicule, although that is probably how this seems but sometimes, even now after all this time, I still find it bewildering that otherwise intelligent and rational minds can succombe to such obvious fiction and when reality disagrees with this fiction it is reality that is to be questioned.

For example, you actually believe that the Garden of Eden as described in Genesis is a literal truth? Despite there not only being zero evidence for and bewildering amounts of superb evidence against but also no way that anyone could have ever recorded these events in the first place.

Anyway, I've managed to suspend my disbelief again so welcome along and enjoy your stay

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Yes I do believe 100%, and I base that belief on experience. Having become a Christian at the age of 37 (14 years ago), my life has been completely transformed for the better and I could never go back to my prior life.

And your personal "revelation" is objective evidence that the whole Garden of Eden fairytale is true?

[KichigaiNeko]

WB is not worth the effort ZEN.... really.

[Whistle Blower]

He didn't mess up, we did when we decided that we could go it alone without Him, and we have been messing up ever since.

If God doesn't exist we have no choice but to go it alone. Most of us here believe that to be the way of it. From my point of view, you too are going it alone even if you believe you're not. Perhaps that is all you need, the sense of being with your God? Do you believe it helps you do what you think is moral or at least what the bible tells you to do (in case you haven't actually given any thought to what is moral). Oddly, most Christians I talk with don't think there is any sense in discussing what is morally better except in terms of God. Battering a baby's head against a wall has no meaning morally unless there is a God that declares it to be a sin. Do you think that way?



You say there would be no rape or murder if people would just get with God because sin just is what happens when we go it alone. I wonder why you think that. Do you feel a compulsion to do harm to others except when you consider God and what He wants from you? I feel no such pull toward rape, murder, torture or even stealing. In general, I don't do to others what I wouldn't want done to me. Why? Empathy. Fellow feeling. Certainly not to buy a ticket to the world's best after life.

I think I actually have the best possible afterlife waiting for me already, as compost. All my organic bits will remain in the web of life and all the stuff there has been for me to notice and to realize will go right on being noticed and realized by others in their turn. What really has been lost? Just a bunch of personal memories? A sense of self importance?

The human condition is a complex one, and cannot fully be understood or lived properly unless it is with reference to The Creator whose image we are made in (Gen 1: 27).

We all have the ability to choose between right and wrong, God has
given us a conscience. I did many wrong things before becoming a Christian, some may seem trivial to others, some would be frowned upon by the morally upright, however my greatest sin was denying God's existence despite knowing that He is a reality.

Ps 14 "The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.”
They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good.
The Lord looks down from heaven on all mankind
to see if there are any who understand, any who seek God.
All have turned away, all have become corrupt; there is no one who does good, not even one."[/b]


At the core of the human condition for us all is sin and rebellion. We are all born into this condition due to the nature of the world which we live in which is hostile towards its Creator. However, it is only accepting God on His trems that we can right with Him in this life and eternally. What are His terms?

Acts 2: 38 " Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

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Yes I do believe 100%, and I base that belief on experience. Having become a Christian at the age of 37 (14 years ago), my life has been completely transformed for the better and I could never go back to my prior life.

to the forums #57

Thanks

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Yes I do believe 100%, and I base that belief on experience. Having become a Christian at the age of 37 (14 years ago), my life has been completely transformed for the better and I could never go back to my prior life.

And your personal "revelation" is objective evidence that the whole Garden of Eden fairytale is true?

You can criticise my faith, my Saviour but you cannot criticise my experience. Why? Becasue I really have seen the light

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WB is not worth the effort ZEN.... really.

Don't be so sure...

[Godscreated]

It's a good thing this site isn't democratic.

[Minimalist]

It is not my intention to ridicule,

I'll volunteer for that job, Z/B.

[ohh EPiC FAiL]

Believe in this book because this book tells you to!! The god of the bible is real because this 3000 year old book says so!!!! Hahaha

[Zen Badger]

And your personal "revelation" is objective evidence that the whole Garden of Eden fairytale is true?

You can criticise my faith, my Saviour but you cannot criticise my experience. Why? Becasue I really have seen the light

And that is not an answer to my question.

[Minimalist]

Becasue I really have seen the light

Great trick to see "light" with your head up your ass.