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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 5:49 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2012 at 5:55 pm by Undeceived.)
(November 1, 2012 at 4:59 am)Killman Wrote: So, I ask the religious, why are murderers so condemned by you? Killman,
Suppose there are two scenarios:
1) Man accidentally kills another.
2) Man attempts to kill another but fails.
Which is more condemned? I think atheists and Christians would agree number (2). Therefore, it is the intent that matters. Jesus said, "Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer" (1 John 3:15). The hate is condemned, not the action, and God does the judging, not us.
"The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart" (1 Samuel 16:7).
(November 1, 2012 at 10:21 am)Fryslân Wrote: Do you believe in a God? If your answer is yes, then yes, I think you are primative and narrowminded. Christians believe there is knowledge beyond the senses. How is that narrowminded?
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 5:58 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2012 at 5:58 pm by Cyberman.)
How is it the faithful are allowed to quote the bible out of context when it suits them but we get shouted at when we do it?
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 6:02 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2012 at 7:11 pm by Something completely different.)
(November 1, 2012 at 5:49 pm)Undeceived Wrote: Killman,
Suppose there are two scenarios:
1) Man accidentally kills another.
2) Man attempts to kill another but fails.
Which is more condemned? I think atheists and Christians would agree number (2). Therefore, it is the intent that matters. Jesus said, "Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer" (1 John 3:15). The hate is condemned, not the action, and God does the judging, not us.
"The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart" (1 Samuel 16:7).
The german law defines the accidental killing of a human being as:
Quote:㤠212 Totschlag
(1) Wer einen Menschen tötet, ohne Mörder zu sein, wird als Totschläger mit Freiheitsstrafe nicht unter fünf Jahren bestraft.
(2) In besonders schweren Fällen ist auf lebenslange Freiheitsstrafe zu erkennen.“
translation:
Quote:§ 212 homicide
(1) Whoever kills a person without being a murderer, can only be punished with imprisonment for less than five years.
(2) In especially serious cases can be seen to life imprisonment. "
homocide in which a person through his actions willingly accepts that people might die are "especialy serious cases".
the german law defines punishment for attempted murder as:
Quote: § 23 Abs. 2 StGB kann die Strafe für den versuchten Mord gemildert werden. Bei Anwendung dieser Milderung wird ein versuchter Mord mit einer Freiheitsstrafe von 3 bis zu 15 Jahren bestraft
translation:
Quote:§ 23 Section 2 of the Criminal Code, the penalty for the attempted murder can be mitigated. Upon application of this mitigatiion is an attempted murder with a sentence of 3 punished up to 15 years.
no need for jesus. the laws are set and are the same for everyone.
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 7:36 pm
(November 1, 2012 at 5:13 pm)Darkstar Wrote: What is a 'right'? Do rights objectively exist? If by selfish you mean for the species as a whole, and not helping other animals directly, then in a way yes. Our justification was survival and now is dietary. We could live without meat, it would just be harder. However, god cannot encouter hardship, so why does he need us? We raise livestock, and if we kill animals during hunting, the animal had a chance. We don't order all the animals in a forest to line up so we can eat some of them to satisfy our non-existant hunger. Note that I'm comparing our 'need' for meat with god's 'need' to manipulate us. I noted it. It's arbitrary and self-serving. You don't care about the survival of the things you kill. What makes you different?
Quote:Plants are still technically alive, so it depends on how far down you are willing to go. Humans are sentient, but not all powerful. If we were all powerful we would just be thinking steaks into existence, rather than killiing animals to get them.
I have no intention of eating a pit bull, but I would kill one if it were attacking a human. The ants around here do not sting or bite or carry disease, yet I kill them for merely annoying me by crossing a boundary which they can't possibly understand. No one faults me for it. Why not?
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 7:57 pm
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson
God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders
Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 8:39 pm
(November 1, 2012 at 4:59 am)Killman Wrote: I have been thinking about this for a long while now, but the recent event with the child named Lane Goodwin has motivated me to bring it up. For those who do not know, Lane Goodwin was a kid who had some type of hardcore cancer. There was a Facebook page for him for the moral crusaders to jump on and it was called 'Prayers for Lane Goodwin'. This page got almost 400,000 members and was really popular.
Sadly, Lane still passed away, to everyone's surprise. This is obvious proof that prayer does nothing, but that is not the topic. Afterwards, I still seen pictures and comments being put up on this page and people saying the classic bullshit. 'He is in a better place!' 'He doesn't have to suffer anymore!' 'He is with god now!' All that jazz. Basicslly saying that Lane's death is now a GOOD thing. This brings me to my main point.
So, heaven is eternal bliss, correct? Basically, human life is suffering, but if we follow gods word and accept Jesus Christ, then when we die we will go to this eternal bliss. That sounds dandy does it not? Now, Lane still died, despite all of the pleas for his recovery. This, combined with the comments of the fundys afterwards, made it apparent that god let him die, for the purpose of taking him to heaven, to end his mortal suffering. So, with this in mind, god is in fact, a murderer, or at least partially.
The main point: We hate murderers correct? Human beings that end the life of a fellow human being. My question: Why? This question is being asked with the mindset that any of the Abrahamic religions are true.
Okay, a person just gunned down a bunch of people, let's say, 20. 10 were Christian, 5 were atheist, and the other five were of some other relgion. The person who did this, the murderer in this case, if he did not kill himself, will either be excecuted or sent to prison for life. What did he really do though?
For the 10 Christians, he just ended their suffering. He just granted them access to eternal bliss, a quick ticket basically. That is good isn't it? Those people no longer have to worry about death, disease, famine, war, destruction, and all of the horrible things about life. They are now with god. So, he did a good job! Right? There really is no point of being sad, because their deaths were actually a GREAT thing. Now, the atheists. For them, it does not matter. They are going to hell. Some have told me "Well, they could have seen the light eventually!" If those people ever once denied the Holy Spirit, then they are %100 doomed. So, the murderer just advanced the apparent inevitable. The 5 people of other religions? Going by the bible, it is the same gig as the atheists, but they MIGHT have had a chance, but again, that would not have happened.
So, I ask the religious, why are murderers so condemned by you? Is it because they are ending innocent lives, because it sounds like they are not ending their lives, but letting them begin! Is it the fact that they are playing god? Because we all know that god has murdered billions of people and technically still is murdering with disease, but it is okay as long as god does it.
Hopefully my wording here makes sense, but I have really been wanting to bring this up for a while. For those who don't know, I am completely against murder, as I say most people should be, but if I was religious I would potentially see it in a more positive light, as sickening as it is. This is just further proof that religion constantly makes a mockery of everything that life is, including the end of it. Thank you for reading.
Actually I didn't really read the whole thing. What I got was you asked the question why do Christian condemn murder when death sets us free.
The answer is really simple. We condems Murder Because God condemns murder.
Death is not evil. Murder is. The difference is that Murder is the unsanctioned (by God) taking of life.
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 11:06 pm
Drich, do you believe helping someone die is murder? Euthanasia, I mean... Is it better to do everything medically possible to keep someone's body alive, or to help ease their passing with a simple overdose of morphine?
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 1, 2012 at 11:08 pm
(November 1, 2012 at 5:36 am)Daniel Wrote: If somebody says "he is in a better place" that isn't the same as saying "his death is a good thing".
Okay. He died and as a result, is in a better place. This is good.
True
False
?
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 2, 2012 at 1:45 am
(November 1, 2012 at 11:06 pm)festive1 Wrote: Drich, do you believe helping someone die is murder? Euthanasia, I mean... Is it better to do everything medically possible to keep someone's body alive, or to help ease their passing with a simple overdose of morphine?
Yuup
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RE: We Should Thank Murderers, Here is Why
November 2, 2012 at 1:58 am
(November 1, 2012 at 4:54 pm)Daniel Wrote: (November 1, 2012 at 10:21 am)Fryslân Wrote: Do you believe in a God? If your answer is yes, then yes, I think you are primative and narrowminded. As you get to know me you'll realize I'm not narrow minded or uninformed or anything of the sort.
You lose points for professing to believe in absurd fairy tales.
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